Received via email 01-13-06 The results of the last bargaining failure have been on my mind since I read them here on Friday morning. I, like most of you, was stunned that the city representative actually had the balls (no matter how small) to engage our team in a blatant unfair labor practice. That being the reduction of the pay offer made at the prior meeting. Have you filed the paperwork yet Win? I doubt it.
That phony crap the mayor fed the team about holding off on impasse was just another stall. The money spent by us on the full page ad could have been put to better use at the time and I’ll tell you how shortly. Stop and look at the whole situation calmly and with questions. Why is the city doing this to the firefighters? Why didn’t they do this to the police union? What other city in Florida is currently engaged in this sort of tactic against their firefighters? What could possibly be the reason that THIS city chooses to demean and insult their entire fire department? Why does the council giggle and squeal their approval every time we get tricked at the bargaining table? If the mayor is behind this how does he justify his actions to the council without looking petty or childish in his tactics? Why is it that it seems that everything we do is not producing results? Where should we go from here?
First let’s look at what HASN’T worked. There’s a couple things. ANTICIPATION: the thinking in the beginning that collective bargaining was going to produce a contract.
CONFIDENCE: the continued attitude toward the team that they were skilled enough to go toe to toe with the city and win.
INTEGRITY: the ability to justify clearly and honestly the proposals made by the union.
PATIENCE: the willingness to wait for the collective bargaining process to work no matter how much the city undermined the process.
PROCRASTINATION: another willingness to put off action that would bring the process to a conclusion.
FRUSTRATION: waiting for two years for a contract that never comes.
HONESTY: the willingness to believe the mayor when he speaks instead of realizing he’s nothing but a liar.
FULLFILLMENT: Waiting to see how long it takes the council to see how asinine this is getting and step in to resolve it.
We have been victim of all of these things and they have produced zip. The informational pickets. The letters to the council. The attempts at raising public awareness of the problem. The false assumption that the majority of the public gives a shit about us. Education. Political action. (What a loser that one is.) The International and their assistance. (No help there either.) Am I the only one who thinks we’re somehow going about this the wrong way? Is there no one else who feels the pole being slowly shoved up not only your ass but the collective asses of your entire family. There’s something afoot at city hall that’s driving their actions. Until we figure out what it is we’re never gonna win.
If you think about it there’s nothing we have done that has influenced anyone to do anything in our favor. NOTHING !!! We’ve maintained the status quo just as it calls for in the law. We’ve bargained in good faith even when the city didn’t. We’ve been professional in our protests and continued to have faith even when things didn’t get accomplished. We’ve been proud and upheld the traditions of firefighting in the face of some of the worst treatment this department has ever suffered. And for what?
I can only offer “a suggestion”. It’s not the answer to all that’s wrong and it’s only one person’s opinion. But I know it’s worked in the past and it’ll work again. The first thing you have to realize is that parading up and down in front of city hall will gain you nothing. Hell, the paper doesn’t hardly write about it. The television channels use the camera shots as a photo op between murder stories. Helping political hacks get elected doesn’t work. It never has. It never will. At least not in St. Petersburg. We’ve done all the little activities that muster the troops and sung the songs of solidarity and for what? Total and complete failure up to now.
Think BIG !!! So far the union has done all the things that are customary to do and things that were effective in the sixties but are now pretty tame and very worn. And the public and the council have become conditioned to the antics of the firefighter’s union when they want attention. That’s why we’re getting nowhere when it comes to applying the pressure that would make the politico’s and the public take another look.
This home boy effort is lame. And with appreciation to all those who have taken part and been willing to participate it has gotten us nothing. Is any of this sinking in? What gets the attention of the public and the city humps more than anything else? IMAGE. The image of St. Petersburg being the bustling metropolis of the Florida west coast. And the ever present god of merchants…MONEY. Money and image fuel the entire system. So here’s my “suggestion”.
Instead of spending our money on political bottom feeders and such why not take our problem outside the city. Since we don’t seem anxious to spend it on unfair labor practices and we don’t have the balls to declare impasse at the bargaining table we may as well spend the money for something that may produce results in a whole new way. I’m not gonna get into specifics at this time but think about what some of this might do:
Billboards on I-75 proclaiming St. Petersburg as the anti-fire fighter city.
Billboards on I-4 proclaiming St. Petersburg as the anti-fire fighter city.
Newspaper ads in USA Today and other major publications declaring St. Petersburg as the biggest anti-fire fighter city in the USA.
Letters to IAFF locals telling them to vacation elsewhere.
Letters to the Police, IBFO, Electricians, etc. asking them to tell their members in other states not to spend their money in St. Petersburg.
Demand that the IAFF send support to aid in securing a contract. Be prepared to create photo ops and disrupt activities.
Ask for donations from other IAFF locals and other unions to help support the fight against the city.
Things are not gonna get better by themselves and you have to admit that it’s clear that the city stooge is just having fun at our expense at the bargaining table now. It’s a hoot to the council and the mayor to see us come in expecting legitimate negotiations and being burned again by their next trick. It’s a game, people. They just wanna see us dance over and over to their tune. There’s nothing to be gained by screwing with us. It’s just a pastime for their mayor. He’s having fun at the expense of our lives and our families lives. Don’t believe me? Then explain to me what there is to be gained by waiting any longer before going to impasse. Explain to me what gains have been made at the last ten negotiations meetings. Explain to me what spending a thousand dollars on a full page ad supporting the mayor in the last election got us. Explain to me why we shouldn’t stick it up the collective council asses for being the spineless cowards they are to the man.
For some reason I’ve thought all along that the mayor and the chief had some sort of agreement to make our lives miserable in retaliation for certain things. I still think that. I cannot figure out why a city would treat it’s firefighters like shit unless it was just to make them pay for something they did and this was the only way to get back at them. Maybe you can think of some other reasons why we still don’t have a contract after two years. I think it’s tied to the chief. And please don’t tell me we need to wait and see how the city reacts after he’s left. Or would that just prove my point?
Fraternally,
Dick Tully
Fight the Mutts, Keep the Faith, Kick Their Ass
Received via email 01-13-06 Is there a fund where I can donate to the "Dick Tully for Union President" campaign?
Received via email 01-13-06 Please Post; Yes the fund is called PSYCHO's are US.
Received via email 01-17-06 LOL! That's so funny, I forgot to kiss the Chief's ass!
Received via email 01-17-06 Someone just relayed a story to me and I'm interested in finding out if anyone else has heard of it. If this is true, I thought you all ought to know one of the reasons why we are where we are. I was told that a retired SPPD officer was recently in a fire station and asked how our pension negotiations were going. He asked if we had ever got a cost of living adjustment (COLA) as part of our pension package. Apparently the cops have one in their pension. When he was told that this was not the case, he made mention of a conversation that he had with a former union president a few years back. The cop asked the union president why we weren't negotiating for a COLA. He was told something that shocked him. The cop was told that there was no reason to negotiate for something that every pensioner has the right to ask of the mayor. Apparently since you have to give up something to get something else, the former union president thought that this should be taken care of by the individuals.
Received via email 01-17-06 Huh? Isn't this just the reason that Mike Reilly was in a pissing match with one of our council members that just got dumped from council? Thanks Mike - you're one of the few with the balls to ask!
Received via email 01-20-06 draw the sword? my ass!! i hear there's another meeting scheduled by the city for negotiations next week. how many damn times is our president going to get jerked off by the city over this contract. "oh, let us rework the numbers, we'll get back to you. please don't file the impasse papers." kiss my ass!! if winnie's got some tricks up his sleeve, it's high time to implement them. good lord, we look like a bunch of assholes down here in st. pete. granted, is dick baker pulling the strings? probably. but how many times are we going to let this big bird looking asshole bend us over and put us off for another week or whatever?
TEAM Note: Every time we've negotiated, your Union President has advised you (if you were in attendance) that the city and the Bargaining Unit will keep an open line of communications in the event that one side or the other should wish to negotiate. That apparently has happened.
"Draw the sword?" That's been done and can be withdrawn at any time, provided the city's offer meets with our approval. We're still operating on our own timeline, regardless.
Received via email 01-23-06 Your comments concerning contract negotiations: If this is 'our' timeline, then we have a serious problem with efficiency. We should have gone to counsel a long time ago. It's embarrassing the way we are getting lead along by the city. Just get it done! Every new meeting is preceded with the same anticipation and enthusiasm that this 'might be the time' that they finally give us what we deserve. But it's the same song and dance every time we meet with these people. And we act like this is some sort of surprise when they offer us nothing. I'm over it. Go to city counsel and get our raise. Put these people on the spot.
TEAM Note: With all that said, both sides still need to follow the rules of engagement. As long as there is ongoing negotiations in good faith -- you negotiate. You must prove your case, that all avenues have expired before PERC will allow you to go before either council or a special master.
Received via email 01-24-06 That is absolutely right. You must exhaust every means to come to an agreement before you petition PERC for a special master hearing on items of impasse. It’s also accurate and is a part of the law that as long as any attempt to negotiate in good faith is demonstrated by either party that negotiations will continue. I paraphrase since I don’t have an actual copy of the PERC law in front of me.
That being said let’s look at our situation. First the petition for the special master. There is, as far as I know, only one issue that is considered at impasse. That being the Pay Plan. All other issues have been negotiated to agreement by both parties. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Therefore the only thing standing between us and a signed contract is the pay issue.
The hump from the city knows, as do the members of our team, that it’s an unfair labor practice to ask for negotiations but never change one’s position. In other words you can’t ask for bargaining and then sit on your same offer or your same position over and over and over every time you come to the table. There must be some movement, no matter how small, on the part of one party or the other. This is how the term “good faith” negotiations is met.
The city hump knows that if he changes his offer each time he comes to the table that he is, in effect, practicing “good faith” bargaining as outlined in the PERC law. The law doesn’t determine or define how far this tactic must be abused before it becomes “bad faith” bargaining so there’s no way to stop this activity other than to petition PERC for a hearing and hoping someone is smart enough to see what’s being done. By law the city can drag this on as long as itwants by making sure that each time they call us back to the table they indicate a change in their offer. That, no matter how ironic, is called “good faith” bargaining in Florida.
So where does that leave us? One of two places. Either we can continue being the saps and going to the table every time the hump calls on the phone, and remember, it’s the hump that has called for the last several meetings not us and each time he changes the percentage and meets the criteria of the law. And we actually have no choice but to respond with a smile or WE will be in violation of the law. We cannot refuse to go to the table. Or… we can do what is being done right now and that’s making sure we’re on solid ground legally when we petition PERC for a special master. We need to show a clear presentation of events indicating that there is no chance for a negotiated outcome on the Pay Plan and that we require the services of the SM. The other thing we need to show is that all avenues of resolution have been exhausted without a successful agreement. Then we also need to show that the city hump has used the law to stall and disrupt the collective bargaining process rather than use it for a mutual agreement.
Also would someone refresh my memory on bad faith bargaining. I do recall that what we used to call “back bargaining” was considered bad faith bargaining and was grounds for an unfair labor practice. I’ll again point out that the city came to the table the last time and reduced the percentage they had previously offered with no other changes being involved. That, at one time, was considered “back bargaining” and was unlawful. It would also be considered additional justification for impasse.
Fraternally,
The old guy who still likes to fight
Dick Tully
Received via email 01-24-06 I would like to give a big thanks to Winnie and the rest of the negotiating team for having the resolve to stick with it until the city made an offer that was not a kick in the nuts. I have heard a whole lot of grumbling from people wishing that we had signed off and voted on the previous offer from the city of 3%. I did not hear any grumbling today. However, I don't believe that we are out of the clear just yet. The city scrubs are still holding the numbers for the next 3 year deal. The last offer thrown out there was 4,5&6. I am hoping that they don't take the extra 1% that was added to the 1 year deal and take it from the 3 year deal.
At any rate, much appreciation to all involved in this negotiation.
Received via email 01-24-06 This is in response to the 01-17 email dealing with the Cops COLA and our NOT HAVING ONE! Believe it! I was there and I heard it from the horse' mouth! There were several witnesses too!
Received via email 01-28-06 To the individual(s) that have been sending the anonymous "Let's go to council" messages to the stations... lets take a moment to reflect. We picketed over a 3% offer, we voted down a 4% with no rollup retro offer, now we have a 4% with rollup. How much better do you really think we can do? You say 4% is the worst. Sez who? You're also pointing out all of the increases that will come out of the raise. Union Dues - "yes" they will go up $0.75 a payday. This will enable the Union to function. The costs have continued to rise in that office just as they have at your house. Pension - "yes" this cost goes up every time you get a raise throughout your career. A top paid Fire Fighter will now be paying $5.26 more a pay day then before. Don't forget your pension is for the rest of your life. Insurance - unless you have a high limit life policy with the city, your insurance is not based on your salary, so that's a "no." In fact I heard at the last union meeting that the insurance rates will go down an average of 4% when the city switches over carriers in April. So, it looks like the typical top paid Fire Fighter will be paying roughly $6.00 more a payday then they are presently. B-T-W, the difference between a 3% raise and a 4% raise is $18.80 a payday. This is 3x the increased amount that we must now suffer with. Going to Council to end up with possibly the same or less makes no sense to me. Lets use Council for the upcoming 3 year deal if needed.
TEAM: Good points - all, Bro/Sis. Should the need arise that we should find ourselves in a position to seek divine guidance from Council, I'd rather go before them with a laundry list of grievances in hand rather than squeezing them for an additional 1% - only! As Winnie said at the conclusion of our last round of negotiations... our brothers and sisters in green got exactly the same pay raise in their first year, so we're not falling behind, yet!
Received via email 01-30-06 Don't talk to me about union dues. I loved it when we had to increase our dues to cover the salary of the full time secretary, and then she was abruptly fired when the vote passed. The union has plenty of money. I think we should vote to rescind that dues increase.
Received via email 01-30-06 Stop whining about union dues. With your attitude it will not be long before you will need the union to represent you for something and you will be happy that you had paid them. It is ashame you are still living with a chip on your shoulder about an event(secretary) that happened so very long ago.
Received via email 01-30-06 What the........ "I think we should vote to rescind that dues increase."
Right-oh, old chap. With all the potential candidates lining up at the door to work in our union hall, I can't imagine that we'd have much of a difficult time finding new blood ('cept one loser) to carry on after our current lot of union leaders leave with their ulcers, gray hair and guarantee of a promotion.
Put me in coach! I'll work with one hand tied behind my back, my nut-sack ripped off and puleeeze... don't make me look like a user -- I'll work twice as hard if you'll only take back half my pay!
Keep your dues. We'll get by without them, big spender!
Received via email 01-31-06 Wow. One comment about a time that I took it in the ass from the union and the witty comments start flying. You guys need to lighten up. Do you really think anyone would vote to rescind? If so, then there may me some merit behind the idea. As for ........."It is ashame you are still living with a chip on your shoulder about an event (secretary) that happened so very long ago.". First, learn how to use a spell check. Second, it's not a chip, I just like to remind everyone why our union dues are so high. But I guess you're one of those people that think the union can do no wrong.
Received via email 01-31-06 Mr. Hanky can’t stop laughing at the post about rescinding the increase in the union dues part of the contract. It’s nice to see that just like in the early years of the Local there’s still folks who don’t get it. And no matter how much Mr. Hanky could talk about it they still wouldn’t get it. Mr. Hanky has seen a lot of those types come and go and the ultimate message to them is the same…. If you don’t like paying union dues or you think the union has failed you somehow… just quit. That’s right. It doesn’t take a lot of thought. It takes even less balls. No one will be angry with you. No one will try to convince you you’re wrong or you should think about it. Because it’s clear that we as a group don’t need the aggravation of listening to you bitch about something that petty. So keep your whining to yourself along with your money and lack of support.
Mr. Hanky
How De Hooooooo

Received via email 02-02-06 Ah, I get it. Shut up and fall in line or quit. That sounds a lot like an administrative attitude that I have heard many people complain about. Funny, I didn't know that was the stance of our union. Good to know.
TEAM: Could be an administrative plant!
Received via email 02-02-06 I agree. I'm under the impression that the money taken out of my paycheck every two weeks entitles me to an opinion. But I guess since I don't show up to every function or agree with everything our union does I'm a sh*t bag.
Received via email 02-02-06 Mr. Hanky thinks you should be reminded of a few things. First, and possibly the most important, is that belonging to the union is voluntary. Nobody’s holding a gun to your head to belong or pay the required dues. Second, why would you want to volunteer to belong to an organization that you aren’t willing to support? Mr. Hanky thinks that’s really stupid. Apparently the vast majority of members of the union feel that in order to keep the benefits won in the past by the union, they should be supportive even if it’s only by paying the dues. That’s the only contribution most members make in their entire time on this job. But they realize that if it weren’t for the union, there are two things that immediately come to mind that you’d be doing. One is working for minimum wage and the other is you’d be asking if “you want fries with that?” Mr. Hanky thinks you must be a FINO. You’re quick to bitch and first to snitch I’ll bet. Damn scab wannabe. Grow up and at least contribute the least amount possible to the union that provides the benefits that you enjoy today. Pay your dues and shut the hell up.
How De Hooooo Mr. Cheapass,
Mr. Hanky
Received via email 02-02-06 XXX
Editor: Half private conversation, here folks. "Yes... I aware of that and it CAN be done. May do that."
Thanks again for the other thing.
-Editor
Received via email 02-02-06 Cheap ass? Believe me, if I left this job the last thing I would be doing is working for minimum wage. You may find this hard to swallow but many of us took a pay cut to work here. Your asking yourself why, I'm sure. That's simple. I love what I do. I just hate all the political bulls**t and backstabbing. So if I want to rant about something that in my view is wrong then that's my right. I will not shut up.
P.S. - Referring to yourself in the third person, how clever. What are you, a 10th grader?
Received via email 02-02-06 Everyone is entitled to an opinion. However, as has been said a few times lately if you are complaining about the union dues, stop paying them. It is VOLUNTARY. Why do you have to bring up "history" and stir the pot. If you were just giving your "opinion" on union dues, the history portion was not even needed. You could just say that you think the dues are too high and wonder why they are that way. Get it? The way it was initially presented was a little more than "an opinion."
Received via email 02-02-06 Did everyone get their new insurance info packets? Hmmm? Where did the 4% cost savings go? Tell me. Is there ever ANYTHING at ANY TIME in the lifecycle of a Firefighter in this city - where he or she can count on something being told as fact, where we can finally say, "Hey they weren't shit'n, the city fathers told the truth!"??? Hellllooooooo... is anybody watching these lying pr***s who'll squeeze the buffalo off of a nickel?
TEAM: We just had the the very same discussion. Maybe we'll get a more definitive answer in the days to come. Thanks for mentioning it, though.
Received via email 02-02-06 Hmmmm, Mr. Hanky is very concerned about anyone’s mental health that makes the statement that they “took a pay cut to be a firefighter” and they would make more money working somewhere else. Mr. Hanky sees no reason to insult a brother here but in general he thinks that’s pure bullshit. You have to be pretty damn stupid to take a pay cut to work here. Or do you? If a person is that educated or that skilled they’d have to be lacking an intelligence gene to make a move like that. No, no, what I think you meant to say was that you thought it over and decided that changing professions would give you things that you couldn’t get anywhere else.
First, you only work one day out of three. That gives you two days to either continue in the profession you left on a part time basis making those big bucks or attempting to learn a new trade somewhere else. Two, there’s a pension (and a damn good one) attached to this job that you couldn’t get anywhere else. And with pensions being phased out in most major places of employment it was worth the change. Third, the money, even though it wasn’t the big bucks you could make where you came from was in the $50,000.00 range and that was for working only one third of the year. Those are the things that caused you to change professions. Not some self righteous blather about “I love what I do”. That looks good on the resume or the Request for Employment form but doesn’t fly when the real reasons surface.
Mr. Hanky will leave you to “love” the job and wish you only the best and safest career possible in a profession of high risk. Yes I am in the tenth grade and after looking at your personnel jacket I see that I’m two grades ahead of you. All that aside brother, Mr. Hanky has no bone with you. He’s sure you’re a fine brother and take the job seriously. And he thanks you for that. He also wishes that you would put your attitude on hold for a second and talk to an official who is leading this union and find out for yourself what is being done with your dues and why they are the life blood of the Local. You will be surprised at what gets done by so few for so many who think paying dues is the only thing they’ll ever need to do.
How De Hoooooooo
Mr. Hanky
P.S. Did I mention that all three of those reasons are as good as they are because the UNION continues to win those improvements at the bargaining table?
Received via email 02-02-06 Mr. Hanky your post is true but smells like shit. Why must you use Mr Hanky? I thing spongebob might work better or even your own name.
Received via email 02-04-06 Wow, you really think you know people, don't you? I could go on and on forever regarding this subject, but I know you just wouldn't get it, or for that matter, believe it. Because in your world, your right and everyone that doesn't agree with you is wrong. I will leave this space for more important blather, but I will leave you with one thing. Step away from the computer monitor every once in awhile, I think it may be making you delusional.
Received via email 02-05-06 Your comments concerning contract negotiations: You could go on and on forever and some will not get it and some will. However, with the way the paragraph you wrote is worded (02-04-06) those of us who would like to try to get it need to know what the heck it is you think we were not getting in the first place.
Received via email 02-05-06 Mr. Hanky isn't doing anything, anybody else on this board isn't already doing. You folks who want to know who his is, don't necessarily disagree with him and you want to know who he is too! Sounds like you want your cake and...
Give the pissing match a rest. You boys are all on the same page. You both know where the Mutts are and their ain't any posting on this page!
Hooyah! FTM
Received via email 02-10-06 For those who have'nt heard, the 1 year contract vote was counted today Friday 2/10. The Rank and File returned with 216 yes votes and 25 no's. the Supervisors returned 19 yes votes and 0 no votes. City Council will vote to ratify at the Thursday meeting 2/16, with the possible effective date of the new pay week 2/20. It's only a guess how long it will take to coax the correct numbers out of oracle. Hallelujah!!!!!
Received via email 03-06-06 Why is our hard earned retro, (now a bonus) being taxed 25%??? No seperate check either? It is obvious that the suits have once again, stuck in to us....I hear that there will be maxi pads passed out at HQ on Thursday for free... Their way of softening the blow.....
FTM FTP!!!!!!!
Editor: I'm sure it's not a software issue. The very same software program that caused heads to roll at Bay Pines Veterans Hospital, is lovingly adored by the City of St. Petersburg. We shouldn't have bought the program, but rather been paid to Beta test it and find many of the flaws in it, over these many years!
Received via email 03-06-06 Since we're on the subject, the following is from a Chicago Sun-Times article:
City workers' back pay takes tax hit
February 25, 2006
BY FRAN SPIELMAN City Hall Reporter Advertisement
How would you like to wait 28 months for a new contract and three months more to
get it ratified?
Then wait until February for a back paycheck you were counting on to cover
Christmas presents -- only to find that it's a whole lot lighter than you
expected?
That's what happened to 10,500 unionized city employees -- including members of
AFSCME, nurses, building trades, police lieutenants and captains -- thanks to a
change in the way the city withholds taxes from retroactive paychecks.
Bumped into higher tax bracket
Instead of taxing retroactive pay at a flat rate of 25 percent, Acting City
Comptroller Steve Hughes lumped the supplemental check in with the rest of
employee earnings, kicking them up to a higher tax bracket. If they want the
money back, they'll have to wait until they file their 2007 tax returns.
"Some average checks were $5,000 gross, but they took home less than $2,000 . .
. What they did was destroy the morale of thousands of city workers," said Will
Irving, secretary-treasurer of Laborers Union Local 1001.
"Out of 2,100 members, we probably received 1,500 calls" complaining, said Lou
Phillips, business manager for Local 1001.
On Friday, aldermen and union leaders unleashed their anger at Hughes, who
appeared to take a giant step backward in his drive to get the word "acting"
removed from his title.
"That was a terrible thing and it's not a good way to start. People remember
when you take money out of their pocket because you're hitting them where it
hurts," said Ald. Emma Mitts (37th).
Budget Committee Chairman William Beavers added, "If you want to stay
comptroller, get it right . . . Either do it, or you're not going to be here."
Consulted IRS
Hughes acknowledged the decision he made after consulting the IRS has imposed a
"burden" on city employees.
"The IRS allows two methods. One is the flat method, which is 25 percent. The
other is this method that the city used. When we contacted the IRS to get advice
as to how we process payrolls, they said to ensure that we're doing proper
withholding on each paycheck, to use the latter method," he said.
"It works 99 percent of the time. In this case, it's such a high lump-sum amount
that it spiked a lot of employees to a higher tax bracket."
The explanation was not enough to satisfy union leaders, whose relationship with
Mayor Daley was strained already by the 28-month wait for a new contract.
Asked whether the episode would have any effect on labor support for Daley if he
chooses to run for re-election next year, Local 1001's Irving said, "I decline
to answer that."
TEAM Note: You can bet the first phone call WASN'T to the IRS, but to the League of Cities or ICMA!
Received via email 03-10-06 Just because everyone is happy with their big checks, does not mean that we aren't still behind. The city is laughing at us, lets keep the pressure on. Unless nobody gives a s-it anymore.
Editor: Like many, I would have forsaken this pay raise that doesn't even start to address the real problem - to realize some more security in retirement! "Happy" is a relative term!
Received via email 03-11-06 I got pay raise I should have recieved years ago. I'm still five months behind on this year's pay raise. I work for the largest department in the county. I have the largest call volume in the county, but I'm paid less than departments that are smaller and run fewer calls than I do. Sure, I'm jumping for joy. You can't wipe the smile off my face. Jackass.
Received via email 04-25-06 Are we bargaining at all? I still belive we are still currently working without a contract. Maybe we should get this fixed instead of wasting so much time on the building vote.
Received via email 04-25-06 Oh, is 'that' what you believe? So much for your ability to read and comprehend!
Received via email 04-28-06 Your comments concerning contract negotiations:4-25 How can WE get this fixed when WE don't know what the hell is going on. Like you are going to get off your ass and do something. Pay Attention what is going on around you !!
Received via email 04-29-06 to 4-28: That is what I am talking about. We were so informed about the building vote. We have heard shit on the contract. Sorry I could not make the last union meeting, it was changed to a week earlier which was my shift day. All I am asking is for some info. Everytime you ask it is the same ole I don't know whats going on.
Received via email 05-01-06 To 4/29, have you called the Union office and asked someone? Probably not.
Received via email 05-19-06 A writer Takes umbrage with the "working without a contract" comments - see Guest Author's comments on the Editorials page.
Received via email 05-20-06 It sounds like the guest author went a long way around the main question. He should have just asked, "what have you done to help solve this situation?" Have you ever offered to help with research? Typing? How about just showing support to the Team? Maybe one of these ideas will get some results.
Received via email 05-27-06 Are we ever going to get a contract signed? I think we need to go to the media and let the people of St.Pete know what's going on. Maybe take a full page ad out in the newspaper. The guys with 5 yrs on the jobs will get to retirement before we sign a contract. Anybody with less then 5 yrs should think about going to HCFR or TFR where the city treats there FF's right.
TEAM Note: That's the very same drum that our PD has been banging. They seem to hold the record for new officers abandoning St. Petersburg for greener pastures!
Received via email 05-27-06 It’s funny how as you get older the things that incite your emotions change. I’m what most of you would consider an “old timer” and as such I see things a little differently than most. That’s not to say that I don’t think the young guns have a valid concern but only that from experience I see things in a different light. I especially liked the post on 5-27 that stated
“I think we need to go to the media and let the people of St. Pete know what’s going on”.
In other times and maybe in another city this would be a great strategy. Fire fighters are responsible honest folks doing a job that only a few of the entire population can or want to handle. Therefore if they say they’re being screwed, in whatever direction, the public would come to their rescue and set things straight. Those days, if they were ever here, are long gone. I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again; the people of St. Petersburg couldn’t care less about you as a public employee, let alone as a firefighter. And to even imagine that the Pink Sheet would support us is beyond comprehension. This isn’t a new “solution” to the problems we have as it has been tried over and over and been a total waste of time and money. We're the victims of the failure of the press to report the situation without bias and the failure of the population to give a damn if they did.
“Maybe take a full page ad out in the newspaper”.
Again, the only one that would profit from that activity is the newspaper. That tactic was tried in the seventies and got us little or no help. In fact if you want to see a copy of the page we paid for just visit the union office. It’s on display on the wall there encased in plastic as a testament and reminder to our effort in futility. I don’t know what it would cost to purchase an entire page of the pink sheet in today’s money but it would be money better spent on something else.
The writer of the 5-27 post makes an excellent point though. Why haven’t we got a contract signed yet? And please don’t tell me that going to a meeting will have a calming effect on my inquiry. You can attend all the meetings you want but it’s what happens at the bargaining table that counts. I have to think that after the fine job the team has been doing so far that they’re not on top of the situation. But it’s a legitimate concern by the membership as to why it’s taking so long to come to an agreement. I think some movement in some direction would be appropriate. It would appear that just getting to the table is an insurmountable step at this point.
And speaking of fine jobs I would like to take this opportunity to say thank you to the webmaster of this site for the Memorial Day tribute to the soldiers who have fought and died for our freedom. A very professional display of respect and thought went into that page and I hope every member has taken the opportunity to view it.
So that’s about it from Blairsville, the future home of Spike Jones and the current home of Rob Dobbins. Spike we’re waiting for you. The torches and pitchforks have been distributed. C’mon up.
Fraternally,
Dick Tully
FTM - KTF
Webmaster: Thanks for the kind remarks on the Memorial Day index page. It's an important time in our history - with D-Day right around the corner! As to your growing compound of Fire Fighters... With the cost of homeowners insurance going up by three to five times down here in the hurricane belt, even if the real-estate market in Blairsville got hotter, the one-time licking we'd take from buying in, can't compare to the licking we're taking on a daily basis from Citizens Insurance Co.!
Received via email 05-27-06 The last full page ad I saw was in last week's paper where the rich folks said thank-you to the man that built their gazillion dollar home. That ad cost a measly $45,000.00. If the city won't come to the table then how can you have a meeting? This information IS available at the meetings. Oh B-T-W this is such a hot topic, only 6 out of 370+ members attempted to find a way to attend the May meeting. There was no meeting for a lack of quorum. Now, do we really want to
continue on how hard it is to get information?
Received via email 05-27-06 I don’t know what to tell you. I was president from ‘76 to ‘80. During that four years we had many instances of no quorum so that’s nothing new. And I didn’t say the members don’t need to attend the meetings. I’m only pointing out that some activities that sound good in one’s head yield zip when put into use. Going to the meeting to find out that the only news related to the bargaining is that the city “won’t come to the table” doesn’t incite a lot of interest. Consequently, no matter how important attendance may be it’s not going to increase with the re-hashing of the same ol’ stuff month after month.
Again, this Local needs to be demanding collective bargaining on a regular and timely basis. Documented refusals cloaked in bullshit by the city are what’s needed to prove an unfair labor practice. There’s three words seldom seen in print or heard in the meetings. Every time the team asks for collective bargaining and is stonewalled by the humps at city hall they should file an unfair labor practice. I would have to think even the PERC will take notice after enough filings. The worst that can happen is that the city has to respond to the charges on every filing. This may cause some monetary outlay from the union but it’ll be worth more than the $45,000 for a full page ad.
One of the problems appears to be that the team would rather be patient and amicable in their relations with the city negotiator. When in fact they should be holding that cretin’s feet to the fire. Just one question here: what is the city wanting from us in order to come to the table? Who knows? Please disclose it to us if you know.
The leadership has gotten two monumental things done in the last year. They got the SS offset removed and agreement to a substantial one year contract. There’s no one on or off the job that would argue that those are two great accomplishments and the facts are duly noted. But one fact still remains and that is we don’t have a contract for this year yet and it’s been 8 months. Eight months of stonewalling by the city and eight months of us letting them get away with it.
In the city’s eyes they’ve given up the store in the agreement to the two concessions. In the city’s eyes they think we should shut up and sit down. In the city’s eyes they’ve done more than enough to improve our contract and pension concerns. So they stonewall. Not because they want to accomplish a bargaining strategy. But instead they do it because they can. And no one says
a word about it. That’s what needs to change.
The membership received just enough to shut them up for a year or so. That lump sum at Christmas was just what the doctor ordered. And they won’t get past that until next Christmas. I know this isn’t gonna be a popular opinion with most but there seems to be distinct kissing period going on between the rank and file and the white shirts. Especially those at the paper palace. “Give the chief a chance.” “He’s reaching out to us. We need to respond in kind.” “Give peace a chance.” “Can’t we all just get along?” I think everyone needs an opportunity to settle in and make adjustments. I don’t begrudge them that at all. But there’s a separation between what the department does and what the bargaining team for the Union does. They’re two separate entities. The contract, when there is one, determines the working conditions and the department makes it happen. So maintaining a strong presence at the bargaining table doesn’t mean we hate the chief. The team needs to snap out of it and get back to business. The honeymoon should be over by now and it’s time to get tough or stay home.
Fraternally,
Dick Tully
FTM - KTF
Received via email 05-29-06 Great post Dick, the idea about filing an ufair labor practice is an excellent idea. Be sure the union has been considering that in recent days and will follow through when the time is right. If the city keeps screwing the FFs and their families, eventually legal action will follow and justice will prevail. This is America not a communist state. We must be patient and let the legal avenues be pursued.
Received via email 05-30-06 "When the time is right" was long ago. Do it now! I'm over being jerked around by the city while they sit on a pile of cash.
TEAM: AMEN!
May 31, 2006 - Webmaster's Note: Someone left a message on the Contact page concerning the lack of contract movement. I was asked if I would post a poll to gauge the Brothers and Sisters responses as it pertains to the contract. More specifically, a list of choices was loosely proposed outlining strategies to be employed - ranging from the sublime to some more radical.
Before I post a poll, let me ask you all something. Does any one of you believe that the hold-ups have been on the part of Local 747's executive staff? I think not! Personally, I think our time might be better spent making phone calls to our elected officials. I'll round up their phone numbers and email address' and prominently display them here. You can all decide for yourselves if you wish to make a call or send an email. Each and every one of us is a property owner in the City of St. Petersburg. We've just spent another $200,000.00 to prove it. We too, deserve a certain measure of accountability
What do you think would be the most beneficial questions to ask?
Have you seen any good web page counters lately? The one on this page now shows that we've been holding up our end of the bargain - attempting to negotiate for a fair and equitable contract for 2 1/4 years!
My first question might be, "why is it that we haven't been able to sit down with the city's negotiator for the past 3 1/2 months?" We've been stalled by these folks since February 15th.
My second statement/question relates to the first. Owing to the fact that 'historically' we've never been able to get more than "It's not ready yet" out of the city's negotiating team
(RE: specific pension improvements) as we were initially informed that the city wouldn't spend the monies for any actuarial studies, so SPAFF finally spent it's own monies to lend credence to our proposal's viability. "We'd now like to see the results of the much heralded and anticipated 'city' paid-for actuarial studies."
Other than working well as a stalling tactic, it makes absolutely no sense at all to drag this out further. 'Our' actuary created the entire database and had the numbers for us in short order! For the city to continue to tell us that the 'numbers' aren't in yet, is utter BULLSHIT!
Received via email 05-31-06 It seems that the current city administration has no understanding of the fire service. It appears that they believe our work is like anyone elses and we don't
deserve any more money or benefits. In fact, to them we are way over paid. They don't appreciate the fact we run calls 24 hours a day, risk our life daily, with either hostile environments or deadly exposures (aids, other diseases) that we can bring home to our family and kids. They say they appreciate us in word only to make themselves look good in the public eye, but behind closed doors and during negotiations they see us as the scum of the earth. It is an embarrasment to have such city adminstrators representing our city. If only the citizens new the truth! The only way they will ever understand what we do is to do our job themselves, which of course will never happen. We are the only ones that know what our job entails and only we can change the city's thinking. They may never like us, but if we stick together and educate the public better, maybe we will have a chance to increase our living standards. Until then, it may be a hard road. Keep fighting for whats right and fair until we all are delivered the benefits and pay we deserve. If we are willing to give everything we have for 24hours a day to every citizen whether rich or poor, our pathetic administrators should give us the little we are asking for!! Stick together and KTF
TEAM: You been reading my notes... An 'E' Battle Ribbon for you!
Received via email 05-31-06 When are we going back to the streets? I need to get my red shirt cleaned and pressed.
Received via email 05-31-06 Yeah let's get back in the fight. This dragging out by the City is BS and down right criminal against us and our families!! Lets go !! KTF
Received via email 05-31-06 Remember one thing... members of our current city administration like to go into certain fire houses and do ride a longs. How many actual fire calls do you think they go to during the 2 hours they were there? Also while they are there and the more often they frequent, how much easier for you to open up and answer questions they dont even ask? I know we can't stop them from visiting, but next time, lets suit them up and take them to a TRT trainig evalution, or a hazmat or how about an extrication drill. Get them out there, let them sweat their azzes off; get a little sunburn or misquito bitten. Put one out in a friggin summer time downpour with lightning poppin around them. Yeah you get the pic I'm paintin', scare the be-Jesus out of them and let them know without a doubt, THIS IS WHAT WE DO.... We don't know what will happen or when it will happen, but everyday it happens somewhere, and we need to have all of our forces available at all times.
Received via email 06-01-06 Heres a new line I just heard recently:
A city needs to run effectivly, not necesserally efficiently. That means the services must be provided at any and all costs. It's strange that we have some of our own that will go out on their own and leave no stone unturned to find a way to reshuffle staffing to staff and new vehicle or to put a new vehicle for station 13, but this information never gets shared with the people that can help us the most - your neighborhood associations! Get them involved. Tell them that they need added staffing in their neighborhoods and give them the straight unarguable facts and let them speak up for us all.
Received via email 06-10-06 To the last post on 5/31. You are absolutely right. Perhaps we should not let it be so warm and fuzzy when they are at the stations. Let them go out and test hydrants, practice for BCE's, or even just get them out in the hot ass sun in the afternoon of summer. In order to do this, it has to fall back on the Company Officers do take some innitiative and get up and go. We are our own worst enemy at times and we need to change. We have to give some of these people an opportuntiy to feel what it is like to do the job we do even if they only feel it for a couple of hours a month. We do much more than hop on the truck when the bell rigs and everyone need to understand that.
Received via email 06-11-06 Yes,,,, I wonder how many of our elected officials will volunteer to come out to ride for 36 hours with us when the next big storm comes through? Wait until they are told to open their wallets because we have to go out in the storm to try find a store that will sell us food for the next couple of days... Let them stand for a couple of hours waiting for the power company to come out for an arcing wire. That would surely change their views.
Received via email 06-21-06 Hey the elected officials have their money, do you think they really care about us and our families? Hell no, if they did, things would have changed a long time ago. At least some of our brothers will be able to provide better for their families, to bad they had to leave this dept to do so !! KTF
TEAM Note: Have you noticed that we haven't removed the links to the 'Times article depicting Council's and the Mayor's record pay raise just six months ago? Some might forget, but we can't. Take a gander at the new Politics page and see what can be accomplished if you WANT to!
And if I'm not mistaken - word has it that we're losing TWO of our own this week!
Received via email 06-21-06 We must all be a bunch of friggin whimps letting the city sh-- on us like they have done and continue to do year after year. Let's all man up and get into the fight. Its a disgrace that these (low volume call departments) kick our a-- in pay and pension while we just sit around and let these city administrators treat us like crap. Come on, lets wake up the sleeping giants in all of us and change this BS. We are behind you LOCAL 747 leadership, lead us into battle against these pathetic so called city leaders. Or should we say city losers who care no more about public service or our citizens - as they do their own selfish ambition.
TEAM Note: "...lead us into battle against these pathetic so called city leaders."
What would THE DUKE say, anyhow? "Let's draw the sword and ride that lightning bolt!"
Received via email 06-22-06 Amen to the 6-21 ribbon. I know our leadership has the knowledge and ability...but how about some friggin aggressiveness and passion shown toward the cause. It's long overdue.
Received via email 06-21-06 6/22, I agree, its time to stop talking - lets start walking. Hey, that may be a great new picket slogan. "No more talking - We are Walking!!!" If we become pest's to every city admin., eventually - maybe over a period of time - no matter how long it takes - we may see some changes. I think I speak for a lot of us!! Our families are worth it, aren't they??
Received via email 06-27-06 Supposedly, word has it that our Fire Chief is meeting with the Mayor on trying to increase our pay and benefits. If this is true, this will be the greatest thing a chief has done for us FFs in years. If this is true, wonder how the Mayor will respond? Will he back PUBLIC safety, or just throw 'em the scraps. I thought true public service is first providing good public safety and then taking care of those that provide it. Let's see what this Mayor is all about. "The public or himself." We shall soon see !!!!!
Received via email 06-28-06 I can tell you the answer to that right now. The mayor doesn't give a rats ass about you or me, he cares about his pet projects and furthering his political ambitions. Nothing more.
Received via email 06-28-06 On an advertisement for this little dept, look what is listed "Located in Pinellas County, the City of Madeira Beach offers a true family environment with a one-station department and co-workers with long tenure PLUS competitive wages and benefits like the Florida Retirement System (FRS)! "Your retirement contributions are paid 100% by the City as well as your medical, dental and life insurance." That little dept kicks our butt on pension and health benefits. Why????? Unlike our city administration, theirs care more about their future. Oh darn we must be getting punished because we run some 45000 + calls a year. What a bunch of horse sh-- !
Received via email 06-29-06 Go to ANY bay area department's site. On 9 out of 10 of them you will find better pay/benefits/working conditions.
Received via email 06-29-06 I saw that ad! What an embarrasement to our city pension plan!! You forgot to add their earnings - pensionable- are based on 'gross' not 'base' pay like ours. Wow, our plan does suck!!!
Received via email 06-29-06 Hey at least the last of the summer drills will be over this week. Could you imagine if we continued throughout July. That would be insane!
Received via email 06-30-06 Oh I heard there are several more drills scheduled for July.
Received via email 06-30-06 This just in.... Check out the union info line. Next St. Pete contract date is July 27th. I wonder if our city team has been looking at these ads too? Msaybe they are ready to do something... Ha. I'm not going to hold my breath. If our Mayor and Councilman Bry have their way we won't have enough money to entice losers from a three time drug addiction program.
Received via email 07-01-06 HEY MAYOR, I have heard many people (paramedics) whispering about following the lead of some of our newest members as well as Kevin McConn. These other departments are looking better and better all the time. Keep holding up our contract and you won't have anyone but Sunstar medics responding to all of your great condo, townhomes and vast business empire that you have amassed at the expense of the ones who do the dirty work. All of our medics are going to get smart and go somewhere else. We will be losing QUALITY OF SERVICE! This will be a great problem in the very near future. We can not even get anyone to apply at the rate that we are losing medics. So keep up the good job you CHEAP ASS!!! As in life....you get what you pay for. KTF
Received via email 07-02-06 What if the mayor don't really give a shit about our medics in the first place? Remember the EMS contract is coming up soon, and what better excuse to get rid of the entire program then to just say, "we aren't able to fulfill our part of the plan anymore." I know it don't make a lot of sense since the costs are paid by the EMS contract, but this guy has done stupider things.
Received via email 07-02-06 It's a hollow threat 7/1 and they know it. Somethings are better left unsaid.
Received via email 07-03-06 7/1 you hit the nail on the head "QUALITY OF SERVICE" by the city's past comments noted in the paper, we see that QUALITY is out the window. When you have greedy business people in charge, quality and service means little, profit means a lot. And thats where we are my friend until this clown and his court jesters gets out of office. Only a couple of years left until we have a new team taking over.
TEAM: "...cheaper, faster, better!" -NASA
Received via email 07-04-06 To 7/02...On the surface, it appears as a hollow threat. However, I feel that it is not a threat at all nor is it hollow. It IS what is happening. The medics will get smart and realize that they could have it much better (financially and professionally) somewhere else. Not only will they leave, but the are leaving. It will turn into a snowball effect. I hope that Icabod Crane will wipe the dollar signs out of his eyes and realize that we have a real issue that the city has failed to recognize over the past 8-9 years. It is not too late to wake up! But, we must do something quick.
Received via email 07-05-06 7/2 - hollow threat? 6 leaving in the past month and all totally unexpected and all going to other departments is no hollow threat my friend. That is real life happening. We need to get used to the fact that we are becoming the new stepping stone for new FF's and new medics. No longer will Gulfport, Treasure Island, and Pasadena be the old stepping stones, now St. Pete is!!! Get used to it because Hillsborough, Tampa, and soon to be Pasco County and Sarasota County will be the homes to settle in - no longer the great and mighty St Pete, unless our city admin gets off their a-- and boosts up our benefits, pay and pension package! Heck if we were all making more money and increasing our pension, we might not be bitchin' so much at the training drill right in the middle of the summer. Wake up St Pete, there are greener pastures to be found!! Hopefully our fire admin. will back us in going to city hall and making ours so green that no one will ever even think of leaving!! KTF
Received via email 07-05-06 If you think that any of our top administration is going to stand up against this Mayor, you can forget it. Just remember, they already have theirs.
Received via email 07-05-06 Well then I guess we will be losing a lot of good people soon; people with experience and people that really cared about others. Sad but true, we have already lost some with many more to follow. Seems like our pastures are more filled with manure than green pastures, but eventually that manure will make our pastures green again, it just may take some time. In the mean time, during this administration it may stink awhile.
Received via email 07-09-06 The stench gets stronger every day!
Received via email 07-15-06 Don't forget, wear your red and show up in strength for the negotiations meeting on the 27th. Let's show the gutless bean counters that we are still holding strong and have the will to win this thing, that at least we call bargaining in good faith.
Received via email 07-27-06 I hope the union guys told the city to kiss there ass and walked out. 3-3-3 is an insult when the mayor got what 15%.
Received via email 07-27-06 Well, well, well. The City really jammed it in our ass's today. A three year deal for 3/3/3, no increases to pension, no increases to health care benefits, not a single give a shit to us. Why you ask? What about our problems? What about all the rumors? Well the way I see it, its real easy to f**k someone over when they think non one in our group really gives a shit. What's he talking about, you ask? 900 days, lots of hot air trash talking, absolutely no commitment from our own ranks. Still puzzled? An exiguous, teeny weeny, teensy, all but invisible group of less than 20 of us thought it was worth our trouble to make the effort to come out and show our support for a cause that will affect our futures for the rest of our lives. So you see, a force to be reckoned with we aint. This city will continue to drop dump truck loads of shit on us every chance they get when they know we won't stand up for our beliefs. So for ALL you that chose to stay home and straighten out the sock drawer or figured someone else would come through for you, Thanks a whole MF'n lot. I'm glad I won't have to depend on your sorry ass's to much longer.
Hey Kevin, any openings over there?
Received via email 07-27-06 Nope, but I hear Hillsborough is ready to call up some more talent from their double-a farm team in St Pete. Run like the wind my friends!!! Don't forget the DROP Plan (drop your city owned crap on the steps of City Hall on the way out of town). Where's those signs and red shirts??
The Beach Guy
PS,
I'm still waiting for my "Exit Interview"
Received via email 07-28-06 Do you know what was the wort part of the ass pounding we got during the last session? It's the fact that after all the talk of how our admin. has been talking to the Mayor and has been explaining our dire situation and how everyone has come to an agreement that something must be done blah, blah, blah. Then to have OUR two Fire "menstruators" just sit there while these proposals were spread upon us like the many layers of CaCa this city is famous for, I realize they may have been caught some what off guard, but.... They should have immediately requested a caucus, gone into their little room and commenced an ass kickin upon those that made these tremendous insults to us. Thanks for your help guys. I was beginning to believe some of the rumors myself about how they were finally beginning to stand up and tell the Mayor that they demand that we get more. Oh well, another day closer to retirement I say. Saturday's lotto is up to 25 mil so I guess I have less to lose there than I do working for SPFR. FT Mayor and our own two Bumps on the log menstruators. I wonder how many visits we will get from our new chiefs now? If any of us do get a visit from our newest "friends" I hope we all let them know how disappointed we are in THEM for not standing up for US.
Received via email 07-28-06 I keep hearing "We have to go through the process of negotiating before we present our situation in front of council" (impasse). Exactly how long and how many chances do these jackasses get?
Received via email 07-28-06 We need to take it to the news media; picket all functions in this city and we need to let the people of this city know how the firefighters are treated. And as for my sock drawer, I'd rather clean it out than get the same B.S. shoved up my ass every meeting. Things will never change unless we make a stand. I'm not going to play this game anymore. W.N. man up and get serious dont take anymore shit.
Received via email 07-28-06 Yeah, so much for the new admin that is on our side. B.S.! If they were they would have stuck up for us in the meeting. I am sure the new proposal on new hires being medics within 3 years came from our very own fire admin. Well guess what new admin., you had a good run for the past few months and brought morals to a new high, but after yesterday's negotiations, we all see it was as usual, LIES and MORE LIES. FTM FTM FTM
Received via email 07-28-06 Well I was there. The way I see it, is the two from HQ (one was chewing on his glasses and the other was trying to keep from falling asleep). I wish one of them had the BALLS to tell the city that they CANNOT SCREW US LIKE THAT!!! But I hope they are ready to man the trucks! One still has his medic patch and the other can be his emt. WOW look out! How about Rescue 3???
Received via email 07-28-06 When have any of us experienced the stalling tactics that we've witnessed over these last 2 1/2 years? This bullshit is right out of the League of Cities playbook and it's about time that we close that chapter for good. The City's negotiators constantly operate on the edge of legitimacy and while we've been smart, we've let them take the rope home with them that they should have hung themselves with, long ago!
On it's very face, to offer 3, 3 & 3 after previously offering 4, 5 & 6 is not a 'fair' negotiations practice. I think they're testing us and I hope we pass the test.
Received via email 07-28-06 I have always taught my children that you "do well by doing good." Somehow that message seems to have escaped this city's leadership.
TEAM: Thank You...
Received via email 07-28-06 Sounds like we should file an unfair labor practice suit against the city, since in the State a Florida a verbal agreement is just as binding as a written one. Sometimes the stupidity and lack of knowledge by our city administrators baffles many of us.
Received via email 07-28-06 To the 7/28 poster who states he aint gonna stand for it no more, Hell he won't even show up and SIT DOWN
Received via email 07-29-06 In 1963 a certain fire fighter ,Lee Harman, was just a country boy but he was a damn good fire fighter and he said something to me one day that has stuck with me since then and it’s as true today as it was then. He said that firemen are “a lot like rats.” “When they can’t find anything else to bite they’ll bite themselves.” I don’t know if he originated the thought but it’s been one of the truest statements about the fire service in the People’s Republic of St. Petersburg to this day. The sooner the union can come up with a common goal that effects all the members the sooner our anger and frustration can be focused on that instead of each other.
I believe I warned against getting too warm and fuzzy with the new administration when the decals were authorized for the helmets. There were those who said I needed to back off and shut up because the new administration was nothing like the old one and needed a honeymoon period to make adjustments and settle in. Well now you see that experience is the way to education and not the other way around. I hope this experience has educated each of you to the real world.
By the way…and I wasn’t there so I’m guessing… but I’d bet my next pension check that the two fire administrators who were sitting at the bargaining table weren’t there to plead our case or even smell like they were in agreement with us. By their nomenclature they’re tied securely to the opposite side in their status and even if they’re sympathetic and in agreement with the union they dare not show it at the table. Ms. Giggles would have their asses. You can’t seriously believe that either of these administrators would sell their career to voice an opinion. (They won’t and neither would you in the same position.) Especially one in favor of the union. At least not publicly. For all I know they may be members of the Local but when put in that position they have lockjaw. And unless I’m again mistaken they’re in attendance to enlighten and inform management’s side of the proceedings should any questions arise requiring their expertise. They’re not officially there for us, the union, per se.
I can’t express how disappointed I am in the outcome of Thursday’s negotiating session. For the city negotiator to come to the table and back-bargain AGAIN and leave unscathed without so much as a threat of legal consequence is totally disheartening and the continued unwillingness of the Local to call the city on it is becoming hard to swallow. I’ve supported the bargaining team and have at several times pointed out the positive and outstanding accomplishments made in the past year at improving many facets of our job. But for some unknown reason there’s a reluctance to get in the face of the adversary. Each time the city comes to the table and hands us crap we bow our heads and leave the room feeling secure in the fact that we presented our side with dignity, intensity and courage. And that it won’t be long now until the city sees it our way and caves in to our demands. We swallow every lame ass excuse they make to drag out the process lawfully or unlawfully and we just suck it down over and over again. And quite honestly if that’s the way the leadership feels we can be successful then there’s only two things you can do about it. One, live with it. Two, change the leadership. Since there’s not exactly a line waiting to run for office of any type in the Local it would appear that we’re stuck with number one.
I really liked the member’s statement that they’d rather stay home and sort out their sock drawer than come to a meeting and hear the same old stuff over and over. Wake up. The reason you hear the same stuff at every meeting is because there’s no attempt by the leadership to make any changes. This site is currently touting the fact that Clearwater’s Local kicked the city’s butt in an unfair labor practice and is owed $7230.00 in attorney fees and such. How nice. And on the same page it’s announced in bold print that it’s been 900 damn days without pension improvements in our Local. What a contrast. Too bad no one in our Local has the balls to challenge the unfair labor practices that spew forth from the mouth of Ms. Giggles every time we go to the table. I know the consensus is that I’m out of touch and the tactics that worked in my day won’t work today. Blah, blah, blah. Just let me say that in those days we didn’t have a classy union hall but we never let the city hump run rings around us without consequence. If he said it in the morning the paperwork was on his desk that afternoon and Rod Smith was in my office in 48 hours.
It’s time to do a couple things. The most important one is finding out for ourselves the exact reason why the team is unwilling to challenge the city. On anything. Next find a new outlet by which we can put pressure on the city where they feel it. Say no to picketing. It’s cute but worn out. Say no to newspaper columns. The public couldn’t care less. I’ll ask it again. Can anyone show me anything positive that has ever come of our involvement in politics? No, you can’t. So put that crap on the back burner. Look for what drives the city and means more to the politicos at city hall than anything else. I think it’s money. But you should make up your own mind. You have to determine what makes the wheels turn at city hall. What can put a doubt in someone’s mind as to whether or not they’d want to start a business or live in the People’s Republic of St. Petersburg. What can be done to drive them away? At the next union meeting initiate a type of contest to gather ideas on what can be done to make the city look bad and get the point across without the three
“P’s”…picketing, politicking, and printing.
Quietly FTM’s and KTF. And the leadership needs to reach out to the ranks and welcome new ideas and concepts and quit taking the easy way. Fight back and stay proud. We won’t get anywhere beating each other up.
Fraternally,
Dick Tully, Retired
Editor: As always, Thanks, Dick.
Received via email 07-29-06 We should of started by not backing Mayor (Hitler) Baker. We need to start putting the word out throughout the state how Hitler Baker and his administration is screwing public service employees, so when Hitler Baker runs for governor he won't have a chance.
Editor: Charlie Crist, all but has this election in the bag. Unless he drops the ball in a substantial way in the next few years, he'll no doubt be a two term Governor. Your boy Baker will probably be harvested for some other cabinet level position as a precursor to his own bid one day.
Outside of these city borders, no one cares about you or I. Devote your efforts towards educating Council as to the disparity that exists between ourselves and others around us. Devote your efforts to educating anyone looking for a career who's interested in a complete package as opposed to a career of constant catching up and gamesmanship, to just keep walking!
Received via email 07-29-06 Is anyone paying attention to the Federal pension bill that passed the house yesterday and is due to go to the Senate in early August? In some cases it prohibits enhancements if funding is in arrears. If it passes we can be sure that this will be used against us.
Received via email 07-29-06 To the many 07-28 posters who are calling for management's heads, consider the fact that this DICK of a Mayor is holding a gun on them. Now don't get me wrong. Each of us makes our own bed and if we choose to make the big bucks in a non-exempt position, then be ready to fend off the fleas. That being the case, this Jimmy Large is moving in the right directions where he holds purview. The Fire Dept. is his to operate as he sees fit. Benefits are another story. He, like us, works for DICK baker but is held to a different standard.
Remember... The St. Petersburg Association of Fire Fighters holds the keys and has always held the keys to the jail that we're in. The door is in Council chambers, not in this DICK of a mayor's office!
Received via email 07-29-06 Here's an idea: billboard on I275/Roosevelt/Ulmerton/wherever traffic is frequent...
"Mayor Baker's raise-35%"
"City Council's raise-40%"
"City offer to Firefighters-3%"
"Being treated like second class workers-priceless!"
Received via email 07-31-06 AMEN TO THE BILLBOARD!!!!!!!
Received via email 08-02-06 The Billboard Idea sounds Great !!
