Received via Email 11-14-07 I kept staring at the photo that the webmaster provided of those who attended the COLA meeting in Largo for our fellow union brothers and sisters. Correct me if I’m wrong but doesn’t the Local give away red T shirts for functions like this? And don’t the vast majority of you have red T shirts from picketing you did at city hall in St. Petersburg? Then why wasn’t there a sea of red shirts at this meeting? You obviously had clothes to wear. I guess you think you’re pretty comfortable now having two or three members of council who will possibly listen to your problems. As far as you’re concerned that’s good enough. Why bother with other people’s problems. We looked good at election time and that’s as far as we go.
Besides that why would we want to help Largo get a COLA? Hell, WE don’t have a COLA so why would we want to help THEM get one? The simplest answer to that is; so that there will be one more city we can point to and say give us what they have. The largest Firefighter Local in the county just turned their back on the Largo Local. Local 747 just said screw you. If we don’t have it why should you? That’s not only sad it’s low. Our lack of support doesn’t go unnoticed by the suits at city hall. It’s obvious to them that we don’t really care about COLA’s in any sense of the word or we would have shown support and solidarity for Largo. Our actions will always speak louder than our words. When we had the chance to show some spine we failed miserably. And neither Largo nor St. Petersburg will let that go unanswered at the table. And I’ll bet the Largo Local has a long memory. And I don’t blame them.
I expect to see the same response and attitude when it’s time to do something for those we supported in the elections too. Not a red shirt to be found. I can’t believe you still don’t get it. “Several members” showed up. “Several members”. How many is that? Three ! Four ! I hope you’re proud of yourselves because those who are paid to take notice of what you do are laughing their asses off. Big tough fire union. I don’t think so. And no one else does either.
Disappointed and Fraternally,
Dick Tully
TEAM: Um... 'cuz they supplied blue shirts?
Received via Email 11-14-07 I stick by the red shirt dialog. Unless they didn't want anything but blue shirts to show. Please explain the thinking behind that. I can hear the tap tap tap of little fingers blindly racing over the keys. And I also stick by what I said about our failure to support.
Dick Tully
TEAM: One would suppose that both current and newly installed council members can't tell the difference between one of their employees wearing a blue shirt and that of another. It was an impressive sea of blue, to be sure.
Received via Email 11-14-07 Hey Tully, if your so concerned, get your lazy ass down here and show up at these events. Disappointed that your still making more noise than action, just like you did years ago around the firehouse. I stick by the dialog - your still an asshole!
Received via Email 11-14-07 I work for Largo and many of us follow what goes on on this site. We all want to thank you guys from Local 747 who came to the council meeting on Tuesday night. You sent a handfull, while most sent none. As to why so many blue shirts, we sent out a memo to all of the locals in the area and mentioned that we would provide everyone with a Largo shirt if they came to help. The memo was on your website before your webmaster replaced it with a picture taken outside of the meeting. Since the active duty guys and the retirees are both requesting a COLA, we wanted everyone dressed alike. We knew that you guys in St. Pete don't have a COLA but are working on one so you'd also be interested in our process, what there was of it. We'll just have to wait until after January to see how the voters decide to vote. Every time another one of us gets anything, everyone else benefits by association.
Thanks again for coming when we called.
Long standing member of IAFF Local 2427
Largo Professional Fire Fighters
Received via Email 11-15-07 I stand corrected and do remember the memo that was posted by the webmaster. I let emotion push the keys when I should have used patience. I apologize to Local 2427 and to the member of my own Local who called me an asshole. The member who failed to sign his name and no doubt didn't show up at the meeting either. SSDD. My intent was to point out the lack of interest the members of Local 747 have for others who need help. There was no intent to stir the pot at Largo. I wish Local 2427 luck in your attempts to gain a COLA. Hopefully the next time you call us we will respond with more than several warm bodies.
With all due respect to those who showed up and to the members of Local 2427,
Dick Tully
Long standing member and past president of Local 747, IAFF
Received via Email 11-15-07 Dick, nice apology but you are still an asshole. Running your mouth.
Received via Email 11-16-07 We all do better if we talk less and show more action! Nuff said !!
Received via Email 11-16-07 Thank you for your current praise and assessment of my person. I'm sure I provide you with ample barbs and observations to keep you busy at the station computer. You're a regular stand-up guy calling other people who you don't know "asshole". I admire your tenacity to keep on provoking anyone who doesn't see things the way you do. Yessir, you are one person I'd like to congratulate for being a role model for the fire service. People who see and hear you speak must think firefighting is truly a profession they'd want their sons and daughters to be a part of. After all you're so glib with the profanity and hiding behind anonymity. Just for the hell of it why don't you give us all another of your intelligent blasts of profanity and trash talk in response to this post. We could expect no less from someone as enlightened and professional as you.
Fraternally,
Dick Tully
Received via Email 11-16-07 I think the term "nuff said" is gay.
Received via Email 11-16-07 I'm humored by the fact that city council all of a sudden wants to hold a special session to resolve the present labor issues. Do they think that we can't see what they're trying to do? Do they really think they can railroad us into an agreement before we get a chance to try out our newly elected council people?
No thanks Mr. Mayor, my schedule looks full until the first of the year, but thanks for trying.
Received via Email 11-16-07 Whatever happened to the committee that was to look into the ethics of the city council? There's a great post on the Home page about them supposedly looking into the council awarding itself and the mayor outrageous payraises in the early hours of the morning when no one was looking. Then everything went black. What happened?
TEAM: We were lucky enough to have a conversation with the individual who brought this information forward to the ethics commission, while at a polling place. While he didn't mention a time line, he did say that the investigation was ongoing and would be a matter for the commission's consideration in the future.
Received via Email 11-19-07 I am not sure, but I think I caught the nuff said guy checking me out in the shower at station 3 last week.
Dudes, be careful!
Received via Email 11-20-07 The nuff said person seems like a fat, soft, furry type of creature. Are we sure its a guy !!! Nuff rhymes with _uff.
Received via Email 11-20-07 Well.....muff said.
Received via Email 11-23-07 Well... buff said.
Received via Email 11-25-07 Maybe... duff said.
Received via Email 11-26-07 How bout... Enough said.
Received via Email 11-28-07 How gay ! Lets move on and talk about the contract.
Received via Email 11-29-07 Heres some news for the city, proving our high risk job. As we all know, having our sleep disrupted and working through the night is normal business for us, not Fire HQ or City Admin. New study confirms this risk. Click below and see:
Received via Email 11-29-07 you girls go watch Oprah, we'll take it from here you ass knockers..
Received via Email 11-30-07 That cancer thing is a stretch. The article is talking about people who work, again WORK, the night shift. Getting out of bed to go to a fire occasionally is not working the night shift. Cops work the night shift and it's long been known that it messes up the body's rhythm when a person does that. The closest we could come, I would think, would be medics who are from the most active stations making enough calls to qualify for "up all night". Otherwise it would be a very hard task to include fire fighters, who most often sleep all night, in the group. And that's not taking into consideration that we do our job EVERY night. After all there are two nights in between when sleeping all night is commonplace.
Received via Email 11-30-07 That newspaper article is about the dangers of working night shifts. I don't know about cancer, but I know that night calls make me all cranky.
Thanks for listening, you bunch of jerkoffs. Now I gotta go take a nap.
Little Wussy Guy,
MLF
Received via Email 12-01-07 11-30 #1, Please for the sake of us all, go back and re-read the story one more time and this time maybe understand the story. Sure it talks of night shifts but it mentions in more than one paragragh the disruption of sleep periods and the confusing of the boidies clock. All this happens WHENEVER one of us awakens to the sound of the bell even if it not for you. If you would open your mind just a little you will see that it aint about which truck responds to more calls or anything like that. I t is about un-interrupted sleep periods and that is fact.
Received via Email 12-02-07 The story revolved around the theory that due to sleeping all day the lack of sunlight was decreasing the bodies natural creation of certain enzymes. I know you lazy ass firefighters are getting your regular 12 hours of sleep at work, but if you are missing the sunlight go work on the lawn during the half of the shift when you are actually awake. Now go make me a sandwich, beyotch.Happy Holidays you lazy bastards.
Your Friends in EMS
Received via Email 12-02-07 Why not have someone document the "uninterrupted sleep periods" of the "average" on duty fire fighter. Let's see how many nights out of one month the sleep is disrupted. Good grief you pussies will cry about anything. I hardly think you'll find that the "interrupted sleep periods" are worthy of panic and consternation (look it up). Go back to sleep Tweedle Dum and if you want something to cry about try the contract.
Received via Email 12-02-07 1st 11/30, obviousily you are not a real firefighter !! Every station runs calls after midnight and many on a regular basis. Even the BLS engines run calls and are awaken all night by either the rescue going out or the big fat ass sleeping next to us snoring all night. And as for the other two nights, you obviousily havent had to work mandatory OT at all. Only a person who is not a firefighter would write such a thing. Now go to your desk and push around your pen from 8 - 5 you moron.
Received via Email 12-03-07 This latest series of posts of posts is incredably assinine. An independant group has uncovered yet another concern to fire fighters conctracting a cancer and we have peop;e with something less than a bucket a whale shit for a brain argueing over the oint of if we deserve it or not. The bottom line is this. Everyone in the Emergancy Services profession has many more nights of inturrupted sleep than those in other jobs. Someone has discovered that there is a connection between these persons and those that are diagnosed with this form of cancer. Since the only way to prevent it, is to get out of this line of work altogether, lets be thankful that someone has brought it into the limelight and now maybe, it will become yet another listed job related cause of injury or death that will enable our surviving family members a couple more dollars in a benefit. Thats is ALL this story is about. Now go back and make your sandwichs and take your naps and make your bad decisions, but for crying out loud learn to accept news you can use.
Received via Email 12-03-07 United we stand divided we fall. Stick together and quit hammer the dog sh-- out of each other. We are trying to all improve the 3 things we really need the most. Better pay, better pension, and better work hours. Stay focused !!!!!
Received via Email 12-04-07 I think it is important that paramedics try to take the information from this study and explain it to the firefighters in a way that they can understand. Of course, the hard part will be waking the firefighters up from their 3 hour afternoon naps or 10 hours of nightly sleep, but we can try dammit. We can try!
Received via Email 12-04-07 well said 12-04 #1 sadly, it will fall on deaf ears!
Received via Email 12-04-07 You know that guy a few paragraphs back? No, not that guy. No, the guy that wanted us to get along, yes, no wait. Not that one. The one from 12/03 #2... yeah, that guy. Well, fu** him.
Received via Email 12-04-07 I don't know who the guy is that used the words "incredibly", "independent," "contracting," "people," "arguing," "point," "interrupted," "that," "sandwiches," and "asinine," but he spells like a douche bag.
Happy Holidays,
The Spelling Guy
Received via Email 12-05-07 Medics are and always will be the heroes. GET USED TO IT SLUGS.
Received via Email 12-05-07 Medics are wanna be nurses. I luv them in their white stockings, and cute lil caps!
Received via Email 12-05-07 I used to enjoy seeing old Rescue 6 running around town with it's torn hood decal. PARA DICS. Pretty much sums it up in some of your cases!
Received via Email 12-05-07 For those of you that are not in the business but wondering what the difference is between firefighters and paramedics, allow me to explain. Paramedics spend years in school so that they can deliver over 85% of the emergency services offered by our fire department. Firefighters on the other hand spend 9 weeks in an academy learning how to clean the fire station and make it nice for the paramedics. Paramedics could not do this job without firefighters. Well, they could... but the firehouse would be all messy.
Hope this clears things up,
Chiefy McChieferson
Let's hope the private meeting goes well today. It's way past time for this city to get off of it's wallet.
Received via Email 12-06-07 Who gives a crap about a bunch of lazy teachers? And I don't give a crap about anything in Hernando County, except for a few friends of mine. So when you talk about a bunch of lazy part time whiny teachers getting an undeserved raise, then you tell me they are from a place I don't care about, I care so little I feel my head trying to implode.
Thank you,
Reverend Jesse Jackson
Received via Email 12-06-07 Thats true about paramedics and firefighters, but I think the firefighters need a bit more credit. They don't just clean the station, some of them cook for the medics, too. If we could just get them to make our beds for us, then we would only be doing about 84% of the work.
Famous medic/heartthrob
TEAM: One of the good guys who didn't let fame go to his head.
Received via Email 12-06-07 I love teachers. They deserve their $$ and raises. They like to play hide the sausage with us 14 year olds..
God bless em all!
Received via Email 12-06-07 Jesse Jackson - Professional Shakedown Artist!
Received via Email 12-06-07 That is WAY out of line. Not ALL teachers are pedophiles. Sure, a shit load of them are. But some of them are just lazy do nothing goldbricks that can't make it in the real world and work more than 6 hours a day or 8 months of the year. Those that can't DO... TEACH. Those that can't TEACH, teach P.E. (where they can watch children change their clothes and shower). And those that can't even teach P.E, work in the school office.
Thank you taxpayers,
I loves teaching oh dontcha know
Received via Email 12-07-07 Firefighters are like the first string football players in the NFL and medics are sorta like the water boys or physical trainers. Yeah they may keep more busy, but we know who the real playmakers are. No go fetch some water like you do on a fire scene, nurse maid.
Received via Email 12-07-07 Football makes for a good metaphor, but its more like the medics are the players and the firefighters are the pretty little cheerleaders that say sweet things to us as we leave the station for the field. Now lift up your skirt and bend over for big daddy.
Received via Email 12-07-07 Medics are players alright, playing with their little medical tools. Now go fetch a bandaid !!
Bargaining Session #4
Rank & File - Captains & DC's
Date: Friday - December 17, 2007
Time: 2:00 pm
Location: Municipal Services Center
Room: TBA
Received via Email 12-08-07 Medics are there for firefighters when they get hurt. I don't know what firefighters, with their nine weeks of training, can do for medics unless a medic bursts into flames or something. Of course being firefighters also, maybe medics don't need the nine weekers at all.
New City Council Members
Swearing In Ceremony
Date: Wednesday, January 2, 2008
Time: 11:00 a.m.
Location: City Hall Council Chamber
175 5th St. N.
St. Petersburg, FL 33701
Come join us as we witness the swearing in of our New Council Members.
The Oath of Office will be administered on or about 11:00 a.m.
All members are welcome to attend. A-shift on duty.
Received via Email 12-10-07 Ok, enough of the medics do all the work and are the greatest show on earth. Lets look at a simple illustration. Fire department budget. Over 40 million with about 12.5 million for ems. That looks like over 87% to me right. WRONG. EMS only gets a little over a quarter of the pie, and most of that is for salary. I would say, NUFF said, but I'm not a medic.
Received via Email 12-11-07 Jesus Christ.. If you me-dics think your that special, and do not desire to fight fire, carry your pompous ass over to Sunstar, or AMR in Hills., we sure don't need ignorant, arrogant know it all's like you. F-T- wanna be firefighters. disclaimer: Not all paramedics spend time trying to get out of surpression. Some even make awesome officers, and recall the main mission of Fire Rescue Service..
Happy Holidays.
Received via Email 12-11-07 Those budget figures show suppression is bloated and inefficient. EMS does the most with the least. Thanks for pointing it out.
Received via Email 12-11-07 There's that NUFF said guy again. What a panty waist.
Received via Email 12-12-07 A rescue truck is less than 100K and gets used a dozen times a day. A ladder truck is 600K+ and gets used a dozen times a year, mostly for changing light bulbs. Medics do 85% of the work, but suppression is responsible for about 98% of the inefficiency. Thanks for pointing that out.
Received via Email 12-12-07 I see your point. Medics do most of the work for less than a third of the budget. I guess the analogy from the federal budget is that paramedics are the military that do so much with so little, and firefighters are the government tit sucking welfare mothers all pregnant with their third illegitimate children spending their days wondering what else the system can do for them as they watch cable tv from a couch that somebody else paid for.
Received via Email 12-12-07 At the next union meeting let's all (firefighters) show up and vote to remove the paramedics from the Local. They think they're so special and all. Let's see how they do on their own. Separate the two entities and build the paramedics little manufactured housing units that have no kitchens, no beds, no toilets and no TV. After all with all the runs they make they won't have time to be using any of those things. Give them all pink jump suits so they can be distinguished from the firefighters at the scene. Put as much bling as possible on their trucks so that they can be distinguished from fire trucks. No more red. Titty pink should be the color for all things "medic" related. Just one other thing. Ask a paramedic, any paramedic, why he became a paramedic. If the first answer is anything but "for the money", he's lying. Wouldn't any reasonable person think that if any of these paramedics knew that the job entailed as much work and dedication as it does that they would have signed up for it? Hell no. They say it's for the compassion for people and they always wanted to be a paramedic and help people. BS. They became paramedics for the glory and the money. And now they don't want to do the job to earn either of those things. They'd rather punk the firefighters. Then get pissy when anyone calls them on their real intent. There's no doubt in any intelligent person's mind that today's fire service is REQUIRED to provide certian protections to the public. That's where "saving lives and property" comes in. But the Paramedic classification arose as part of the fire service not the paramedic service. I think we should have no compunction in removing paramedics from the fire service. Let them be a separate and single unit of protection for the citizens. Put them under the control of Parks and Recreation. Let them get out on their own and see how the city treats them. They can have their own union........and........oh, that's right. There is no paramedic union for them to join. Given that fact and the fact that the firefighter union no longer wants them it looks like they're at the mercy of the city. I'd feel sorry for them but golly gee I just can't.
Received via Email 12-12-07 Most medics enjoy firefighting. They just need something to do during those weeks and weeks between working fires. Now go back to the kitchen and fix me a snack.
Received via Email 12-12-07 I'm not a medic and will never be, but look to the south and look at manatee, with bls fire service. Theres not one dept. that we want to use salary figures with as ff's. Take your meds.
Received via Email 12-12-07 I thought paramedics "arose" as a extension of hospitals and funeral homes. That was late 60's early 70's, John and Roy weren't until the mid 70's, just thought I could help.
Received via Email 12-12-07 12-12#3 is giving himself just enough rope to hang from. A fire department without EMS is toast. Like it or not, without medics your pay and benefits would go right down the shitter. Go find an FD of any size without EMS, they will tell you. You think the city resents you now? Go back to the table and tell them why you need 250 people to handle 5000 calls a year.
We in EMS always get a kick out of you guys that sign up for a job that you are only willing to do about 15% of. It's called "Fire RESCUE" for a reason. We don't like the bullshit calls either, but what's the point of crying about it? Crying is for bitches. We are here to help people, and unfortunately for you guys that think that waiting for fires so you can utilize your 9 weeks of training is your entire job... the truth is you are EMT's. Get used to it. We quit hiring slick sleeves a LONG time ago. Stop crying and do your job. Your WHOLE job.
What we should be doing is looking into sending paramedic pay somewhere above Lt., maybe about captain pay. You whiny half man half bitches are making the REAL firefighters on this job look bad. You should be kissing paramedics asses and thanking them for NOT bargaining separately. If that ever happens, good luck proving to the city the need for your budget when they see that the little paramedic union of 60 or so men and women are handling 8 times your call volume for less than one third of the money. The city knows they have to pay for fire trucks, and they know they have to pay for paramedics, but they don't have to pay as much for firefighters. Most firefighters in America work for free. Throw medics out of the stations if you want, but it won't be like a bad marriage where you are the angry wife throwing out the breadwinner... if we go, we won't be sending any alimony checks.
My suggestion? Keep cooking our food and keeping our toilets clean for us for when we find time to shit. You are the only ones that have enough free time for the housework. And stop your crying. Those tears make me want to give you something to cry about.
Received via Email 12-13-07 12-12,#7. You started out with an honest statement, that went quickly went south. It is pretty obvious that you are an angry bigoted person. Would like a workplace that isn't all screwed up with clicks, and backstabbers? Try doing your fair share. (Talk is cheap, and so are you if ya let it go by un answered.) No not just the call volume. Pitch in, even when your tired from running some BS calls. Believe me, I have had my share of B-S calls, both EMS, and Fire. 24 hours is a long time to be in close quarters with people you are hammering behind your keyboard, but laughing with them. Try something new, constructive talk..Its a thought.
Received via Email 12-13-07 12/12/07 .........go back and read my post again. Now sit down and shut up you little prima donna. Of course cities need to provide EMS. I didn't say they didn't. My point, the one you missed, is that maybe you would be better off outside the fire service. Obviously you don't like it in the fire service. Your statement that "crying is for bitches" is certainly the pot calling the kettle black. No city employees cry more about the job they hired on to do than you girls do. I used to have a lot of respect for paramedics. Because as you know the SPF&R ISN'T the only place you can find them. I've seen them do dramatic things and make life saving decisions in the face of almost any situation. But on this department paramedics have way too much time to whine and they do a goood, no, make that great job of it. If you can... stop and think for a moment about the fact that the FIRE SERVICE is what you belong to. Not the paramedic service or nurse wannabe service. Those before you were in the fire service and those after you will be too. It's always been about egos. Most paramedics are well meaning good guys who have been blinded by the light of thinking they are saviors. Once that happens medics think they are something far and above the normal rank of human. Well get over it. You're not. Your shit stinks and you put your pants on the same way I do. You can howl over the statistics all you want but you're still firefighter's FIRST. At least you're supposed to be. If I'm not mistaken you went to fire school just like all the rest of us. But then you saw the chance to stay out of burning structures and remove yourself from the work of overhaul. You saw the chance to stand in the street and watch while real men did the job YOU were trained to do but you haven't got the spine for. Yes it's the paramedic life for you. Getting fat people out of bathtubs and consoling frightened widows when it storms. Yeah, you guys are worth at least Captain's pay. Your statistic of 5000 runs is impressive. How many were lifesaving? How many were for personal use? I will gladly vote to remove you walk-on-water thinking dipshits from the union. I'll say it again. Get your own damn union. See how easy it is to organize a new local in this city. Demand starting wages equal to fire department Captain's pay. I've never said we should be a city WITHOUT EMS. Only that EMS should try to function outside the protective realm of the fire service. Once out there I doubt if it will be long before you're just another group of ambulance chasers. You think you're above all the rest of the fire service? Hardly. We firefighters tolerate you. We do this because we know something that you will never understand. We piss you off and there's nothing you can do about it. We know that underneath all the pompous blustering you really want to just stay home and collect your pay. We know that the surface bullshit you spout is just a cover up for your true feelings of inadequacy as men. But we won't tell anyone. It'll just be our little secret. Now get in the truck and go play doctor and tell everyone how important you are. That is if you can find anyone to listen.
Received via Email 12-13-07 For all the other medics on this job that think the firefighters are at the station for the purpose of cooking and cleaning for the rescue crews, let me remind you that their job description goes WAY beyond that. If you are nice to them, some of them will bl*w you. Just trying to help.
Medic Mike
Received via Email 12-16-07 12-13 #2 Has some interesting points, but if he thinks he would benefit from paramedics starting their own union, he is nuts. First of all, paramedics would not need their own union. They could simply negotiate separately like the captains and DC's do now. The paramedics have avoided that up to now for two reasons. (1) They are not yet angry enough to organize. (2) They are smart enough to know how bad firehouse life would be when they start getting paid what they deserve. Firefighters have always been a jealous bunch. Paramedics get new jackets, firefighters pout until they get jackets. Same for jumpsuits and other petty little things. Firefighters resent paramedics and the medics hate to hear the crying.
So until that day happens, and eventually it probably will, firefighters should continue to grin and bear it. Just remember, before medics got here, firefighter pay was low enough to allow some guys to qualify for food stamps. If you don't believe me, go ask some older retired guys.
I won't close with a "go make me a sandwich" or "make my bed, beyotch". I will just remind you that we are all still brothers, and it's better that we ALL remember that.
John the Medic
Received via Email 12-16-07 I have to agree with "John the Medic" in some of what he says. It's true that in the early days before the union there were no Paramedics. And the firefighters were totally at the mercy of the Chief to procure raises for them. The final insult, in case you haven't heard, was when the Chief went to city hall and garnered a $1.00 a pay day increase in top firefighter pay. The men let it be known that that was totally inappropriate. The Chief went back and garnered another $1.00 a pay day in addition to the first one. It was a time when entry level firefighters were paid $80.00 a week for 56 hours.
It's also true that there were firefighters who were legitimately on food stamps. It's not something we're proud of but it's true.
"First of all, paramedics would not need their own union. They could simply negotiate separately like the captains and DC's do now. " You may be right "John the Medic" but I think you wouldn't want to take that chance. I hardly think that your statement that "firefighters have always been a jealous bunch" is true. I think that what's MORE true is that firefighter's after being around you get totally sick of your "better than you" attitude being displayed 24/7. And we obviously agree that paramedics are enamored with "pretty little things". As noted in my first post I think a particularly deserving color of those things would be pink. With white flowers. Kinda like the scrubs the nurses wear.
One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the fact that no one is asking to get out of the paramedic program. No, this isn't the "if you don't like it here, quit" theory. This is a statement of fact. Those in the program who don't leave this city to do the job somewhere else are not willing to blend in. They somehow see themselves as separated above the rest of the service. They want to be acknowleged as the cream of the fire service. They want to be seen as godsends to people who call them for help. But they don't want to be associated with the very class of men and women who provide the backbone of what they do. I know all are not of this ilk but it would seem the ones who are are the ones who represent them.
I totally agree with you "John the Medic" that "we are all still brothers and it's better that we ALL remember that". It takes all of us working to help others and to help each other in this profession. It's not easy and it won't change. A Merry Christmas to you John and to all your brother and sister firefighters.....some of whom are Paramedics.
Received via Email 12-16-07 I am a "senior" medic that dropped a while back. I have thought about getting out of EMS since my pension would not see the difference, but the bottom line is that I feel the need to do more than just wait for suppression or BLS calls. I would be fine without another night call until my drop years are over, but like everything else you have to take the good with the bad.
I am not saying that firefighters are lazy, I am just saying that they don't run enough to keep me interested. I hope that does not offend anyone, but it is my honest feeling about the subject.Don't worry about making me some supper. I am happy to cook, too.
Received via Email 12-16-07 I understand about wanting to be busy, but for God's sake, how much of a beating does one take. If Medic's are all this magic and light, how come this department is so inept at finding, nurchuring and keeping them? The EMS program in this city sucks. To the chiefs downtown, it's all about "out of sight - out of mind." The least little accusation by either the county of the public and you're the last one to hear about it and you're asked to explain why you're guilty. To the mayor and council, it's no better. More of the same, "out of sight - out of mind" mentality.
This department is totally inbred. The EMS program here came to a screetching hault, years ago. There is no one at the helm and the medics are totally ignored with any and all questions that don't have to do with the EMS chief's new house. F**k that!
Just ask how many medics we hired in this last round. They'll tell you, "all that we could." That's not because they're not out there. It's because they're not applying here. Like I tell every fireman's kid, "there are lots better places to work where the city appreciates you and the department backs you."
Somebody needs to get a picture of the mayor and the chief sipping girly drinks together. They're killing us. One's a dick and the other's dickless.
Received via Email 12-18-07 Judging from what I heard come out of negotiations yesterday, we must have pissed off the mayor. I guess that means he's still a PRICK!
And I was thinking about moving into the empty house next to his. Hey wait a minute...
Received via Email 12-19-07 I did a Google search for "Mayor who's a prick" and I found your website. Good show!
Cheers from Mick
Adelaide Australia
Received via Email 12-19-07 Just a couple questions:
1. Are the police and blue collar workers negotiating at this time or do they both already have signed contracts?
2. If they DO have contracts what percentage did they agree to when they signed off?
3. If they DON'T have contracts what is the current status of their negotiations?
4. Is the city locked in to a previously negotiated percentage due to multi-year agreements?
5. Is it the team's plan to wait until the current mayor is gone and then ask council for a ruling?
6. Are we now 14 months behind in a contract with firefighters for '06-'07?
7. Just where do we stand on a contract with firefighters for '07-'08?
This isn't a blast at the current administration of the Local. It's just an attempt to sort out what is going on. It's difficult to say the least to keep which year we're negotiating for and who, other than the firefighters, has what. Could someone please answer the questions? Short and to the point answers please.
Thank you
Received via Email 12-19-07 26 years, 26 years, I should have payed attention in school. 26 years to find out that we are the worthless ones, the ones that don't deserve to be compensated for putting our lives on the line. True, true, putting our lives on the line is not an every day thing. Being away from our families is! The car brakes down, we're at work, the waterheater pukes out, we're at work, little Suzy's play - oh you know. This is all crud that we know, maybe some "other people" can read. Even though I can't spell too gude.
Received via Email 12-19-07 Thanks Mayor Baker for such a generous offer. Our families and children appreciate your kindness during the holiday season. I am sure your little measly raise this past year has put a strain on your holiday. Thanks for your giving nature and your self less ness. Your a model for all to admire and look up to. Merry Christmas.
Received via Email 12-20-07 The next time this PRICK of a mayor tells you that the city can't swing more than 2.5% for a pay raise because of tax hikes, tell him that if he really cared about public safety, there are other ways:
Received via Email 12-21-07 I started to answer 12/19 #2 and I realized I don't know either. GEEZ WHAT A MESS
Received via Email 12-22-07 ANY CITY'S FIRE WITHOUT EMS WOULD BE KNOWN AS VOLUNTEER
Received via Email 12-23-07 For the past "20" mayors!
Received via Email 12-23-07 There are tons of paid fire departments without EMS. They suck, but they exist.
Received via Email 12-23-07 Not only is Pam Iorio NOT working towards bringing Tampa's pay and pension up to HCFR's standards, (a 10 year old department) she's pulled the additional man off of the apparatus that she just funded with O/T. No respect for those who put it on the line or the citizens, either.
Tampa - you call, we'll haul. We're getting to be professionals at shoving it the ass of dirtbag council members.
FTM, PTB&S, EGH, KTF, RFB, DTRT -- Hooooya!
Received via Email 12-26-07 Would someone answer my questions for 12/19/07? Is there anyone who can? As I said, this is NOT a slam at the front office. It's for informational purposes. However, if no one knows then it's understandable. C'mon. Someone help me out here.
TEAM: Not sure about the blue collar workers. PD has been to the table and from what we understand, they laid their demands on the table and informed the city that when they returned, (the city) they should be prepared to address each and every point of contention - or don't come back. We are only 3 months out of a current contract. As to a ruling by council being dependant on Mayor Prick's leaving... wouldn't bet on it! The last offer made by the city wasn't their best it was made with the full cooperation of council. They had their closed door session and we're sure there's not a friend in the lot of them. Let's see what the next meeting brings. We suspect that it will produce nothing more than an additional percentage amount for the first year with reopeners. That's just a guess like so many others, largely dependant on the January tax question at the polls.
The negative: they've not said YES to a single one of our proposals.
The positive: they've yet to say NO to any of our proposals, either.
The police chief and the mayor are getting their asses handed to them.
Received via Email 12-29-07 With the holidays and stuff I can see why there's not much activity in the minds of the members of the union. All those city sponsored parties to attend and the departmental soirees keep us up drinking and dancing 'til all hours of the night. Well snap out of it you bunch of hung over trolls and get your asses in gear for a new year of successes and accomplishments. There was some hope that the new year would bring a renewed interest in making sure our new council persons were making educated decisions. Well they'll be in office soon so get off your ass and educate them.
I get a hoot out of what one of us thinks is "handing the police chief and mayor their asses". One citizen and a couple council cretins bitching about a movie they got thrown out of due to the "thugs" from the south side isn't going to change a damn thing. The mayor will stroke the council cretins and calm them down and the "civilian" who's ripped will go away like all the others who have ever said anything bad about the so-called jewel of the city. I don't see what any of this has to do with the fire service. In fact I think it's wonderful that a few council cretins had to clean out their shorts after a night on the town in downtown St. Petersburg. But how does this involve us? Are we to think they will go back and force the mayor to fold on the firefighter contract? I doubt it. But let me just throw this out for thinks...Is it just coincidence that three council cretins were all in the theater on the same night? Since they supposedly have to obey the sunshine laws isn't the meeting in the dark in the theater an appropriate place for these cretins to discuss things? All inocent like and everything. They do their best work late at night in the dark so it shouldn't surprise us.
Let's make this new year one the opposition won't forget. Support Winnie every chance you get. Stay on top of what's going on. Let's get all our butts down to that swearing in ceremony and fill every damn seat at council so that the new members we supported can see that we haven't forgotten them and that we're paying attention to what they do. It's a new year and we need to be willing to make some changes. Instead of the SSDD that's usually perpetuated we need to have a new attitude. Quit fighting amongst ourselves. We waste more time and effort trying to find things to whine about than if we just shut up and worked to make our jobs go smoother. Quit finding fault with everything. Put out a little extra effort. Learn what needs to be done as a union and help accomplish those things. Don't let 2008 be just like all the years past that posted one failure after another. Pay attention. Think. And Happy New Year.
VCF
Received via Email 12-31-07 "Lets get our butts down to that swearing in ceremony" Hope to see you there VCF.
Received via Email 01-12-08 Good showing at the ceremony, lets hope council don't forget us later this year !
Received via Email 01-15-08 With RFs ability to keep a take home car, maybe he could have negotiated us a better deal. What a bunch of sheep.
Received via Email 01-16-08 To 1-15. Danger Danger, Will Robinson, that does not compute!!!!!!
Received via Email 01-29-08 amendment 1 just passed / bad time to be trying for a contract.
TEAM: You could have said "it sucks working for this city" and we would have found it an easier statement to agree with. There are many Local's around the state who've done quite well in the preceeding 12 months, inspite of the fact that this tax pullback was coming. It's not 'necessarily' a bad time to negotiate a contract. But it is a bad time to negotiate a contract in a city that uses it's Police Officers and Fire Fighters as pawns. Look to the top of this page. Tell all your co-workers who don't visit this site, who don't go to Union meetings, who don't check the Union Line - that they need to go to each and e-v-e-r-y one of these negotiations sessions. Don't wait for your Union President to tell you when it's important. It's 'always' important! Karen always reports back to her superiors of our desire for a meaningful contract. She uses the numbers of pissed-off Fire Fighters in attenance as a guage to how well their plan is going. We're not voluteers, and participating at the street level is not a sometimes thing. There's no free lunch.
Received via Email 01-29-08 Do not expect much on 2/01/08 since the amendment passed.
TEAM: Don't expect much of them or much of us?
Received via Email 02-02-08 For those not at Friday's nego meeting, listen up. The city is trying to shorten the length time that they will pay 100% for an ON-DUTY INJURY...The cheap bastards already only pay 1/3 while worker comp pays the other 2/3'rds. Well, the city wants to limit this to 30 days after someone gets injured during a HIGH RISK event. The union asked for Karen to clarify what is considered a HIGH RISK INJURY and you will be surprised to find out that the city DOES NOT consider an injury incurred during station maintenance like falling off of a ladder while installing FAKE camera's on poles outside the station, as a quailifying event. I guess we need to be a little more careful of what we will do before we offer to suck another "wanna be promoted Officer's unit." Lets pull together on this and stop the nonsense. They want it done, let them pay for it without one of us receiving a career ending injury.
TEAM: How many of you who choose to buy-into this Car Seat Technician bullshit, pull an alarm number for each bullshit car seat you install? Don't think you can screw your back up while installing one? If you push a stalled car off the road that dies outside the station and you herniate yourself or get hit by another vehicle, would you be covered if you didn't pull an alarm number? Dangle off of a the end of an extension ladder while changing out the flag halyard, lately? Change any parking lot lights at the station, lately?
Note: When repeatedly pressed on what qualified as "High Risk," Karen simply remarked that line of duty injuries that require in excess of one month's recuperation time don't happen that often and as such, we shouldn't realize any substantive changes... Yeah, until it happens to you! We are viewed as less than Fire Fighters and Fire Fighter Paramedics and more to the point - as 'property' of the city!
FTM!
Received via Email 02-02-08 So the mayor won't be giving up his 32% pay raise any time soon?
Received via Email 02-02-08 Any time we are on duty for 24 hours it is high risk. That is the nature of our job. If the city dont like it then, tough sh--! Its our job. Now go shuffle some papers city admin staff.
Received via Email 02-02-08 Dont dispair, our wage $$$'s have gone to good use. Yet another play park is taking shape at 55st and 2 Av. N. I am happy that the parents of these neighborhoods will no longer have to use their hard earned dollars to pay for fuel to take their children to the larger centers located throughout the city.
Received via Email 02-02-08 If I fall off of the plastic smoke detector box and strike my head on the marble floor while installing smoke detectors, am I covered?
TEAM: Karen will let you know.
Received via Email 02-05-08 You will be happy to hear that your new $3.50 100th Anniversary coin has arrived. Couple this with the $4.00 100th Anniversary T-shirt that we got a couple of months ago and you will soon realize why the City cant possibly come up with anything more for our wage or pension increases.
Received via Email 02-07-08 The next time one of you gets your car broken into at the MFS and you decide that you want to provide some more FREE LABOR putting up phony cameras, call Karen Richardson and ask her what kind of pension you'll get if you fall, then call 323-1786 and ask the same stupid question.
Received via Email 02-07-08 I heard that HQ has had some troubles getting the 100th anniversary coin right. Now that the spelling errors are all fixed, try and find the latest mistake.
TEAM: We just popped a new page on the site at the last minute. Know your enemy!
Received via Email 02-08-08 Correction, there is no mistake on the new coin. It seems that during the time the drawing was being photographically digitized for the making of the die, an apparition apparently decided to leave its mark on the coin. However, at the last split second it discovered that it didn't want to be connected to such a ridiculous thing and was able to remove its shadowy figure and just leave the area blank. So in other words a ghost did it.
TEAM: Rational -- factual -- well reasoned -- possible -- plausible -- even... probable. Okay. We're in!
TEAM: Yeah... and there's folks working at HQ that would tell you "You're full of shit!" ;>)
Received via Email 02-10-08 Old news 2/10 #1. How bout seminole laying off 9 and closing a station?
TEAM: Charlie Crist (your next Vice President [just ask him]) told the Fire Fighters at the state convention that "no Fire Fighters would lose their job's." Are you saying he's full of shit, too?
Received via Email 02-11-08 Yes, just like our mayor.
Received via Email 02-13-08 Speaking of Yes men. It would be interesting to list a few yes men from the mayor down, especially within our department. Lets see, who would be the top 10 ???
Received via Email 02-14-08 Where in the hell is my 100th Anniv. coin? Is this another one of those things that gets passed out by the Chief when ever he happens to get around to visiting your station? I see that all past and present City Council members have theirs already. I guess I'll just have to wait another 9 months to get mine like I did for my service award plaque. Ya never know, maybe I'll just retire before I get it. Damn, that would be a great dissappointment, but I bet I'll get over it.
Received via Email 02-14-08 Hey Mister Web Master. Why don't you start a yes-man poll?
TEAM: If you must. We'll supply the structure -- you supply the names.
Received via Email 02-14-08 Awesome on the yes man poll.
Received via Email 02-21-08 Hey, since we haven't had a decent raise since Baker arrived, do ya figure we'll get one sometime before 2020. I hope to get one good one sometime before I retire. Dang, I knew I should have kept that job at Gulfport Fire. Who da figured !!!!
Received via Email 02-23-08 I should have kept that job at HCFR now I have a fat wife and 2 kids
Received via Email 02-23-08 Yea / should have stayed / you would be the fu**ing chief by now.
TEAM: While Dave imparts some great information about the DROP, the 'Times failed to print Dave's eintire Op-Ed. With Dave's permission, we'll post his entire letter somewhere in this forum.
Received via Email 02-27-08 We need more Dave Frasers who are not afraid to tell the truth and tell it loud!
TEAM: Dave's entire Op-Ed can be found on the top of the Editorials page.
Received via Email 02-27-08 to the first 2 23 are you talking about D.K boy did he get suckered in by the wife.
Received via Email 02-27-08 I hate to see the X throught the union logo on the top of the page, but I understand where you're coming from. Great ripoff on the motivational sayings series though.
TEAM: Thanks. Maybe we'll give the 'volunteers' on this job a page of their own!
Received via Email 03-02-08 What is the difference between working ot for the grand prix and ot at the station which I see plenty of union brothers and sisters doing everyday?
TEAM: There's no difference whatsoever. Some that you see working who have been 'manditoried' are working at straight time because very few of us are in that exclusive "Seven Day Work Cycle Club!"
Received via Email 03-02-08 Yes some manditoried but a lot more volunteering.
Received via Email 03-05-08 Last year I (24 yr F/F) stood on the hot road of pit row, sweating my ass off in the fine mandatory way. At least 12 others down there were assigned the same way. This would be a great time to have to use FMLA to take care of that sick family member..or get the exhaust flu..
FTM, and FTGran-Prick.
TEAM: Ha! We'll bet you won't do that again. Oh, and dude... Grand-Prick is not a race, it's the Mayor!
Now say it along with the whole TEAM -- "The Mayor is a Grand-Prick!"
Received via Email 03-12-08 Three on an Engine and two on a Truck until 2000. What asshole's running this place? Someone's going to get killed. PS: They Mayor's a prick!
Received via Email 03-13-08 PPS: The Mayor's still a prick!
Received via Email 03-13-08 And yes, the Mayor's STILL a prick.
Received via Email 03-19-08 Up North - 5 on an engine, 5 on a truck. St. Pete, 3 on an engine, 2 on a truck. Half the manpower = half the service provided. Once the citizens paying their taxes for quality service get wind of this, they wont be very happy!!!!! But hey, "Its a great day in St. Pete"
TEAM: Shit. Nothing's going to change 'till one of us dies. This city's gov't is too inbred to change for the sake of the people.
Received via Email 03-19-08 You all really dont get it. The people do not care how many men are on the units. As long as you keep showing up they could care less. Get your head out of the clouds. And as for someone dieing. They dont care either. Isnt that is what our job is for. Look at Tampa PD when those cops died. Nothing happened. A big fancy funeral and that was it. Wake up and smell the real world.
Received via Email 03-27-08 Ya ever feel like the enemy is among us? The other day during supervisors contract negotiations, it was proposed by the union to allow EVERYBODY who is a firefighter (all the way to the rank of DC) be able to get a shot at all the available OT. This same subject was supposedly brought up during the FF and Lt's bargaining session the other day and nothing was mentioned about it. During the supervisors negotiations Wimberly whispered to Karen Richardson that haveing Lt's, Capt.'s and Chiefs available to work overtime would be expensive. The union asked Karen if the extra money would come out of Wimberly's paycheck. He was quickly told NO! Hahahaha!
If it's going to cost money that the city doesn't want to spend, Karen will tell you. There's shitloads of OT money and Karen didn't even flinch when Winnie proposed that we open up the books to everyone. Wimberly is one of the mayor's biggest suckboys.
TEAM: WOW!
Received via Email 03-28-08 Yeah and put them on a rescue after all they are EMTs and Paramedics!!!!!!!!!
TEAM: Unlike ALL of the city's motives, the Union's motives were pure. The intent is to 'allow' those who wish to work, a shot at O/T. You should all sleep well at night knowing that someone with four bugles is helping the city to manage it's money!
Received via Email 03-29-08 I dont think wimberly will ride rescue as long as he has to wear an American Flag on his UNiform. What a traitor to his country. Maybe he should go to Iran.
Received via Email 03-29-08 yummy overtime
Received via Email 03-31-08 Note to all Union members: When you get your ballot, vote this turd of an offer down!
Received via Email 03-31-08 is there anyway you can have a JW tried for treason?
Received via Email 04-01-08 The city is going to give each of us working the gand prick race a $15.00 food voucher for each day we work. Lets make sure we take them and USE them. Might as well get something for the inconvience they are heaping upon us. Dont let them talk you out of it either. Some are already saying that since we will be able to bring in our own coolers they did think we will need the voucher. Tough take it and spend it.
TEAM: Or just save yourelves the aggrevation and just call in sick. Eat lunch at home with the dog! FTM!
Received via Email 04-01-08 What an idea! Call in sick for OT. Why didn't I think of that? You learn something every day. Hint-Hint.
TEAM: Yeah... 10-4. This is a toughie. Bow to the pressure of a few chiefs that come sucking around, attempting to get you to work OT in an effort to make a city that doesn't give a shit about you - look great -- or call in sick and poke 'em in the ass just like they poked 'us' in the ass during the last impasse hearing. Yeah... that's a toughie. FTM!
Received via Email 04-01-08 That wont happen. You have Knight wanna be's that want to be a 6 year Lt. so they can stand on the back because they passed a test. I would like to see Knight survive in a real fire dept like Chicago or Detroit. Im thinking he might have an "Accident."
Received via Email 04-02-08 Does the six year Lt make a difference? We have plenty of veteran Lt's , Captains, Divisions that do not know a damn thing either. This is not Chicago or Detroit. Apparently you could not get on any of those fine departments or could not survive so you chose here.
Received via Email 04-02-08 RE: 4-2-'08-#1
"We have plenty of veteran Lt's , Captains, Divisions that do not know a damn thing either."
Your statement.
That's a pretty good blanket assessment of some or many of the men and women who have become officers. I have just one question for you; why haven't you been promoted? No, no, no. Don't get all pissy. It's a simple and straightforward question. And easy enough to answer. Why haven't you been promoted to Lieutenant or higher? Give us all an honest answer or perhaps we'll have to start making up our own minds about why you're so much smarter than the current officers on this job and yet you can't become one. You apparently don't agree with the decisions and actions of some of those who lead yet you do nothing to get promoted to show what YOU can do. It's easier to snipe from the sidelines, isn't it? You call these officers "veterans". I suppose you have access to information that is more up to date and current than the brothers and sisters who went before you. You, I'm sure, have all the answers to how to run this department and who should be the ones running it. Fortunately, and I do mean fortunately, you will probably never be promoted to anything on this job. But I also believe that if you ever had the opportunity to be promoted, for whatever reason, that your ass would sing a much different tune.
Knightrider
Received via Email 04-02-08 BLUE FLU TIME!!!
Received via Email 04-02-08 So what are you saying that you settled because st pete was the only one who hired you. probably because you screw other peoples wives or have a crimanal background or ??????
Received via Email 04-02-08 Its time again to reflect on the 6 character traits mentioned on the character portion of this site. Read each one carefully with thought, and tell me how many of the current city administration or fire division chiefs actually adhere to fulfilling these character traits. Search real hard and be truthful. How many?
Received via Email 04-09-08 I got my ballot in the mail today. I was going to vote no anyways but because Jim Wimberly is trying to sway the vote, I'm going to dedicate my vote to him. I didn't just vote no, I voted F**K NO!
Even someone deaf, dumb and blind could figure this one out.
Helen Keller
Received via Email 04-10-08 I attended one of the doom and gloom meetings. It's really odd the way we're all held to this higher standard and rules and regulations prevail if you fail to follow them. Why is it managers fail to think that rules are in place only for us underlings? I'm tired of being stepped on by these fakes. I'm going to redouble my efforts in the future to fight these mutts. They're nothing more than puppets for the mayor.
Received via Email 04-10-08 Watch out. They're talking about taking the beds out of the fire stations again. No problemo.......... I've got my own cot!
Received via Email 04-10-08 They'll take the beds out only if the continue on this same dumb ass path. Take em out, I dare you.
Received via Email 04-10-08 Wimberly and Large are proof positive that having both an education and wisdom (at the same time) is a contradiction in terms.
Received via Email 04-10-08 These are the same guys who couldn't find the union hall or their ass without a map. They've never done a thing for their brothers and sisters that didn't involve taking care of themselves first. Large worries what everybody thinks of him and Wimberly could care less what you think of him. JOW might just as well bark orders to everyone through memos because a two way conversation with him is as useless as tits on a boar hog. He doesn't give an inch and if an idea isn't an original thought of his, forget it. He's the mayors next ass kisser and always will be. When we shitcan this mayor and work to get one of our own in office, Wimberly better start looking to mow the grass on a permanent basis at the kingdom hall!
Received via Email 04-11-08 Well, now I'm going to weight in here. I've seen an old timer or two speak to some of the actions of the folks on this board. They claim that they've never seen such bullshit as what's going on nowadays. The fact of the matter is those of you who were on the job in the '60 and '70 and 80's didn't have the Internet at your disposal to bring much of this bullshit to the surface. Talking amongst yourselves within the walls of the fire station is one thing, but to put it all out for everyone to see is quite another. And I like it! There's little room to hide your dirty laundry now and that goes for the chiefs too. Can you imagine how much shit would have been put our for display if the internet had been around 20 years earlier? All this is meant to say, nothing changes but the days on the calender. The same scoundrels make their way to the top while standing on your head. It's not always about talent but how good an actor you are. If the chief and the assistant chief want to keep their jobs, that's fine. They can do that without going against the mayor on a daily basis. To sing the praises of that asshole by telling us that all is lost and that we're all going to have to bite the bullet sooner or later, is quite another thing. Labor has done just fine without the two of you stopping by and drinking a free soda for more than 30 years and I suppose we'll do fine for another as long as you don't run afoul of us too many more times. Oh, and you can come and take my bed too. If that's the best threat your got, bring it on. I've got a contract and it's not with either or you Koolaid mixing bozo's.
Received via Email 04-11-08 Just curious why doesnt anyone contact the O'Reily show and bring these points up. If our UNion is so great than that should not be a problem.
Received via Email 04-14-08 Can you imagine Large being called into Baker's office? "Haven't you got those boys of yours on the short chain yet? I'm getting tired of telling council that you're going to bring me a contract, Jimbo!"
Received via Email 04-14-08 TBRC We Prevailed!
Date: Apr 14, 2008 4:03 PM
Brothers and Sisters: A short note, the TBRC adjourned their final public meeting a few minutes ago, and were unable to get enough votes to place the tax limitations on local government issue before the voters. Each side, the proponents and opponents were each allotted 5 speakers and ours did very well. Despite several last ditch efforts to gain votes by the "pro" members of the commission they could not muster the required number of votes. Mr. Hogan from Jacksonville, the author of the amendment made every attempt to sway commission members to impose the cap, and former House Speaker Alan Bense voted against us on every vote, but it wasn't enough.
Thanks to all who called or emailed the commission members, now we're back to thwarting Speaker Marco Rubio's bill to cap all school and local gov't. taxes to 1.35%, which would eliminate most all public schools and public safety services in Florida.
Take care
Fraternally
Gary Rainey, Vice President
Florida Professional Firefighters
See what a dedicated, hard working bunch of Fire Chiefs can do when they put their minds to it.
Now get back to work you lazy bastards
Received via Email 04-14-08 Why dont we overthrow the FD Admin or stage a sit in so that no one can leave the building. Have the media there also. What's wrong with us? I'm in it for the long haul also. Deprive them of leaving and things will get done.
Received via Email 04-15-08 Deprive them of leaving and we will be like those moron teenagers in Lakeland--- guilty of kidnapping and looking at prison time. Great plan. What else you got?
Received via Email 04-16-08 Obviously written by a chief to garner sympathy. I don't buy it. I guess they didn't tell you in the "Chief's Handbook" that being a fire chief in St. Petersburg, could really suck, huh?
Received via Email 04-16-08 Wimberly claims that he and Large weren't tampering with union business. If that's the case, then don't place union business on the agenda, you dumbasses! Large needs to stop addressing union business in his memos that he sends to all the stations and the mayor and Wimberly needs to stop bringing up our fight (that leads to a bigger pay day for him) in officers meetings.
Received via Email 04-20-08 According to what Labor Relations was told, the officers that were in the meeting and brought the matter to attention, are in short, "nothing more than a bunch of liars." Fire Admin sez they never said such a thing or even suggested anything close to it. So, if that is so, I now know that I can never believe anyhting that my officers tell me again. A big Thanks to those in the SPFR Admin offices for making this issue so very very clear to me.
TEAM: So what you're saying is, not all the cream that rises to the top, has yet made it to HQ. Good for us!
Received via Email 04-20-08 1st 4/20 Wow, if all of our officers are a bunch of liars, your right - we should never take their word for anything. I am sure glad we have honest division chiefs who would never stoop so low as to tell a lie. Heck, I have never heard of any of them ever telling a lie. Well, no more than one a day. A lie a day keeps the Union away. NOT!
Received via Email 04-22-08 Hey there was another question asked at those round of officer meetings recently by the Ops Chief. He actually asked for a show of hands of who went to the union informational meetings. It really is none of his business. I guess that is not meddling in union affairs either. Heck, he might as well run our next union meeting and tell us all what to do. I am sure he would say, they would not be meddling also. GET REAL!
Received via Email 04-22-08 Gee you must be talking about all the DC's, especially the A shift ones. The wife beater and the back stabber.
Received via Email 04-25-08 Well well well, it appears that after hearing of the results from yesterdays ballot counts that not too many (none) of the Chief's boys paid any attention to him anyways. Out of 19 Supervisors 18 returned ballots marked REJECT. I guess all the bullshit being spread by the upper crusters about how it would be of no use to vote any other way, did not sit to well with them either. On the other hand, 11 suckup blue shirters fell for the big lie. I hope the next time they are on their knees giving homage to their favorite supervisor and receiving the grunt of gratitude, they will at least give it a thought to ask what happened? Oh yes, to make it fair there was 1 Captain that did not return a ballot, so I guess that would give all of them a chance to tell you it was them that did not vote. How about it SIRS, anyone want to claim the title of the non ballot caster?
TEAM: We haven't amended the top of this page yet, but the numbers are as follows:
Supervisory Unit - 19 ballots mailed out with 18 returned. 18 voted to reject - 0 voted to accept - 1 ballot eaten by family dog.
Rank and File - 301 ballots mailed out with 232 returned. 221 voted to reject - 11 on another planet - 69 waiting on a raise to buy stamps.
Received via Email 04-26-08 I got nuthin to do so I show up at the union hall to grab a free soda and take a peek at the DID NOT CARE ENOUGH TO VOTE list and who did I find on that list? He wanted to run the union part time and his initials are RL! Hmmm. Guess the dog ate that one too!
Received via Email 04-26-08 RL did not vote. You have got to be kidding me. Well, I guess nothing should suprise us now!!
Received via Email 04-27-08 The city sends us to diversity training one minute then they treat our Union President with utter disrespect for years on end. Hmmmmmmmm. Typical upper eschelon mentality.
Received via Email 04-28-08 RL said the union hall didn't need to be open every day during the week. Maybe he was taking one of those breaks and 17 days wasn't enough to return his ballot. I'm sure this won't hurt his chances for leadership in the future.(with the dept. I mean).
Received via Email 04-29-08 I can't believe our mayor won't even throw us a bone but is getting ready to shove the new stadium up the city's ass. What a douche bag.
Thank you.
Mr. Editorial Guy
Received via Email 04-30-08 In response to 4/25: Go f**k yourself, asshole. I find it unimaginable to see the editor assign a ribbon for your post when you took a shot at the departments workers.
TEAM: We went back and rearead the post. Editorially speaking, you were right, so we left half of the ribbon there for the good half of the post. Thanks for keeping us on our toes. On a personal note... we understand taking a personal stand, but "what the hell were they thinking?"
Received via Email 05-05-08 For those of you who read the Shorty Bryson article on the home page but don't know him, Shorty was a very popular union leader from Metro Dade until the very day he was promoted to chief of the department. Several years ago I was at the last FPF Convention that he attended as the president of his union. He announced his promotion to chief of the department and made it abundantly clear to everyone on the floor that his association with the men and women in his union was his greatest accomplishment to date and that becoming fire chief didn't come close to topping that! He got a huge standing ovation! I'm sure that there are a number of reasons why the other chiefs chose him to be Fire Chief of the Year but I'm sure that if you asked the people that work with him, (that's work WITH him) they'd tell you that he didn't wait around for the mayor of Miami to ask if he had adequate staffing, a training division with more than two people and enough money to pay for benefits that high risk Firefighters deserve. He's his own man and he's always been there for his people. I'll bet he sleeps well at night knowing that he works with a department full of his friends.
TEAM: Wow! What to say?
Received via Email 05-05-08 Winnie Newton for Fire Chief
Received via Email 05-05-08 Here's another good one. St. Pete Beach is looking to shitcan 3 of their firefighters due to budget cuts. During a city council meeting Chief Golliner was asked if he could tell council when his last fire was. He said "Yes I can, and I can even tell you where it was. He then turned to council and asked, "Can you tell me when and where the next one's going to be?" End of story!
Received via Email 05-06-08 Winnie Newton for Mayor
Received via Email 05-06-08 Fred cares for his people I wish the same could be said for some of our Admin.
TEAM: Agreed! Long time friend of the Fire Fighter.
TEAM: Whoever sent us the raw data on the PD salary numbers, we didn't post them because they didn't come out in a very clean format for posting. The columns were a real mess. Those numbers already appear in a link at the top of this page, though. Here they are again if you haven't visited: http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pMkHgf4SSXKVCU0RjRxPYRA
The numbers represent exceptional pay raises for exceptional people. Keep giving your services away for free to the fools downtown and you'll never see anything near these numbers in your pay.
Received via Email 05-11-08 Why does the Mayor of St Pete dislike our union president so much ? Say it isnt so !
TEAM: They hate him, don't they? The cops aren't getting shit, either. Guess he's screwing things up for them, too!
Received via Email 05-18-08 Somebody told me that Palm Bay Fire Rescue just signed a 3 year contract at 10-10-10. FF's were topping out at around 60,000 before that. It must be nice to have a city that cares about its workers.
Received via Email 05-20-08 5-18, truth be known, their new fire chief worked to get them that. MMMMmmmm wonder what our chief is doing today. Not sure, but the donoughts are good and lunch will be great.
Received via Email 06-13-08 Yawwwwwnnnnnn! guess this contract page brings little interest anymore. No comments here since May 20. Yawwwnnnn, been also a long time since we have had a decent raise, even with the cost of everything sky rocketing. Thanks Mayor Baker for your support - Your the best !!! NOT
TEAM: Negotiations meeting called by the mayor's office. Monday morning, 10:00 am in room 800 - MSC bldg. It still brings plenty of interest. Everyone keeps hitting on it, but you're the first to post in a while.
Received via Email 06-16-08 Well, I talked to someone who was at negotiations today and the city's trying to fool us with our own money again. We've got a COLA, but we've got to pay for it, 100% with 175 money we already have. If the money dries up, so does your COLA. I'm glad I didn't go afterall. I would have mother fu**ed somebody across the table.
This city sucks. They're sneaks and theives - 24-7. Impasse! Bring it on.
Received via Email 06-16-08 Funny how the SPPD already has a COLA and 60 hours of OT that is pensionable each year. They are coming off of a 5-5-5 contract and very upset about being offered a 3% raise (which they should be), and SPFD does not have a cola or the 60 hours pensionable or the 25 year and out and we didnt get close to a 5-5-5, and we are offered a 2% period. And now this BS with the COLA we should already have. The City Admin, AKA the crooked Mayor is trying his spin game once again on Public Service. Heck, its not his emergency we respond to everyday so why should he give a rat about Police or Fire, we are the ones risking our lives and our families lives everyday. Bring on the Waterfront Stadium and lets spend millions again for the next 20 years! Is this city for real? I think the Mayor would do a better job working for the circus than the city, because he is the biggest Clown this city as seen since it was incorporated.
Received via Email 06-16-08 I kept hearing guys say, "I wonder what they're going to give us"? I feel like I just got fisted again.
Received via Email 06-17-08 We would need about a 14% raise just to catch up with what we loss compared to SPPD over the past few years, not to mention we are behind them another 20% or so. And they are behind Tampa 24%. Their (SPPD) complaint is justified and we(SPFD) are beyond in the toilet- we are swirling around the drain with the mayor holding the flushing handle. Sad part is, the Mayor has a smile on his face while he flushes. Heres a new Slogan to replace "Its a great day in St. Pete" " St. Pete, where city employees are turds and City Admin. enjoys flusing them down the toilet." Good thing the bathroom door is shut and the average citizen never hears or sees this going on.
Received via Email 06-18-08 Excellent metaphor calling us the mayors turds. So be sure to thump his balls on the way to the water. Yeah baby. Yeah!
Received via Email 06-18-08 6-18 #1, thanks for taking us to a higher level. Nice work.
Received via Email 06-24-08 I hear the new contract offer is not as insulting as what we are used to. Anyone have any details? COLA? EMT pay increase? Retro? Huh? Anybody?
TEAM:
COLA: 2% (can be lower)
EMT Pay: $32 Biweekly (up from $26)
Pay: 2.5% G.W.I. retroactive, 2nd & 3rd yr. wage reopeners - 1.5% ea.
Attend one of the 'explanation' meetings for a more definitive answer.
Received via Email 06-24-08 Web Master: In reference to the 6/24 post. I am afraid that people are going to see what you posted and get the wrong idea. They will see the COLA and get the wrong idea, not realizing that it is a variable COLA. Might I suggest that you remove the post and have the members get the facts and all the explanations from the UNION. I don't mean any disrespect but you know how fireman are. I feel that this post can gravely impact the vote if people see this without the explanation.
TEAM: Understood, but I made it clear that one should attend an explanation meeting.
"Can be lower." "Can be less." "Might not be 2% throughout history." "Might fail to exist if the taxpayers of the state of Florida, remove ch. 175 from law." We work for the city of St. Petersburg where every day is like groundhog day. None of this should be a surprise to anyone..
I was trying to be even keeled in my original description so as not to crap on the offer or appear to fall in love with it, either.
Viva la impasse! Roll the dice and see who your friends are.
Received via Email 06-25-08
What is a "wage re-opener?"
TEAM: If the members raftify the present contract offer, it's a three year deal. But... in years 2 and 3 we reopen negotiations for pay only.
Does that mean it is a 1.5% minimum, but could be higher? "Yes" and "yes."
Received via Email 06-25-08 Oh Boy a COLA that you have to pay for your self and it doesn't kick in till your sixty. You would be better off just investing the money your self . Then use the intresss and call it a Cola. If its not 100 percit city funded its like pissing in the wind. Whats the use ! Don't be a bunch of morons!
Received via Email 06-25-08 could also be lower if you reopen.
TEAM: The city's initial offer contained no minimum wage reopener. Utilizing '1.5% to 5%' as the framework, a pay raise can be no less than 1.5% and no more than 5%. We proposed a 2% to 5% wage reopener spread. As always, attend a meeting on Thursday or Friday for all the answers.
Received via Email 06-25-08 "Received via Email 06-25-08 Oh Boy a COLA that you have to pay for your self and it doesn't kick in till your sixty." Hey Mr. Webmaster. I thought you threw this asshole off of the site? First things first, the 175 money used to pay for the COLA comes from insurance premiums, just like the cops COLA comes from 185 insurance premiums. I don't hear you bitching about that. As far as investing our own money and using the "intressssssss", tell me where I'm going to get $1.3 million to kick it off? I don't like the fact that the city won't underwrite it, but this fu**ed up mayor won't be in office for ever. We'll get ir right, one step at a time, YA DICK!
Received via Email 06-26-08 How is using the 175 money for the COLA a bad thing? That's exactly what it is supposed to be used for. Calling the 175 funds "our" money doesn't mean anything. Sure, it's supposed to be used for us, but it's not like we have ever had any control over it. It's not a pile of money sitting at the union hall. I see this offer as a good start that we can build on. It's way ahead of any other offer and possibly better than city council can offer since they can't control retroactivity without the mayor's approval... and he's not exactly our pal right now. The second and third year offer is at least open to discussion. The way things are going, it beats a ZERO raise or a layoff. I don't see the public in our corner right now either. I will be going to one of the meetings for sure, but so far so good.
Received via Email 06-26-08 I guess we just have to settle again!!!!!! this time we can blame it on the economy.Not the fact that our union representation goes in to negoiations time after time with the same game plan and strikes out every fn time.I guess they dont mind if we get what we ask for or whats fair,cause they get the same extra union pay regardless of the outcome. How hard of a job is it to travel to confrences eat steak and lobster drink beer and have us pay for it, just like W.N. pays people union money to work for him even when he stays at his home......nice.
Received via Email 06-27-08 WOW 06/26/08 #2 - Your post reeks of animosity or something thereof. Why don't you bring yourself to the next union meeting and stand up and tell everyone how you feel there since you feel so strongly, or at least speak to W.N. directly?
Received via Email 06-27-08 While we're all listening to the half facts from this disgruntled employee of the city about shit that's in our contract for anyone to read, you might be interested in the story that Heather Brady's husband told to all of us at the afternoon explanation meeting, yesterday. He's a retired Police Officer from SPPD and he was very grateful to Winnie, Rick and Bill for finally securing a COLA for Heather and the rest of us. He's had one all along and told us a little story about why we never had a chance to get one earlier. Years before, he'd had a conversation with RF about the fact that the Firefighters didn't have a COLA. Seems he and RF were out in the parking lot of the union hall and he told him that he wasn't going to waste the time to fight for a 2% COLA when the mayor can give us more than that any time we ask. If I recall, Mike Reilly's been asking continuously since he left. Ask around. There were plenty of witnesses.
Received via Email 06-28-08 I love all the talk about steak and lobster. If you've ever seen Winnie at work out of town, it's just that, WORK! He doesn't drink liquour and if he ate steak and lobster every night of the week, what do you care? We've never had so much wealth under any other president. If you don't like the way things are, get the hell our of OUR union, shitstirer/chief.
Received via Email 06-28-08 Read this and try to realize how easy it is for the public to take this information as the only information they need to make a decision. You want to have the public on your side? Hard to do when the paper is giving the city manager all the space. If I was just a "joe citizen" I'd think the fire fighters were doing pretty damn good too. It's extremely hard to drum up sympathy when folks only hear the management side. The perks look pretty nice to folks on a limited income. Hell, the perks look pretty good to US !!! I'm kinda sad that the we are gonna fold like a house of cards for a "iffy" to "maybe" COLA waved in front of us. But it's to be expected and next year when we try to open the contract for pay increases there'll be more bad news. The Clearwater firefighters know how to make it bind. And they're doing a great job of it. Even the "International" is involved along with the PFFF. Where were they for the last three years of OUR struggle. And why aren't they here now? Are we waiting for the "trickle down" effect to take place? For the city manager to be making explanatory statements in the paper to back the city position means that he's feeling the heat. Here's a new slogan; "There's no heat in St. Pete." While we're tripping all over each other to ratify a COLA that should have been a done deal two years ago the International and PFFF are in Clearwater basking in the turmoil. Why is it we're always the red headed step child? Are we waiting for the Clearwater boys to get our benefits FOR us? Is their fight gonna spill over into St. Pete.? No. It's not. We're gonna have to win on our own and falling down over a COLA that is way overdue is pitiful. Hopefully the whole mess will not be ratified and we can get back to business.
Received via Email 06-28-08 Hey, at least twice a month the crew at Station 6A eat Steak, Lobster, Crab, shrimp, and of course Prime Rib. Does this put us on track to be the next Union President? No I guess it just means we don't mind paying extra for what we want. I don't remember seeing the pizza and bread sticks too often tho. I guess that's the cross we bear.
Received via Email 06-28-08 We're on the verge of signing a contract that'a nor perfect but will give us a COLA and someone out there who doesn't like Winnie attacks him with bullshit about steak and lobster and not being at the station to babysit you. Why don't you grow up or grow a pair? It's apparent to everyone on here that you don't like him, so just take it up with him if your not a puss. All the Monday morning quarterbacks are coming out of the woodwork now claiming that they KNEW weeks ago that we were going to get a COLA because they were CRUNCHING NUMBERS for the city. Suuuuuure! What's really funny is that RL and RF are claiming credit for getting us a COLA. RF is a crybaby who's now going to tell us all how he's going to save EMS and the dept. and RL is a namedropper who knows everybody important but they don't know him. Some of you need to get over yourselves. If you work against one of us, you work against all of us. Want to be a dick? Wimberly is looking for an understudy.
Received via Email 06-29-08 The COLA sounds like a start and the contract probably wont be better for now, but you know what is really sad. If the pension fund had the 88 million in the account from the unfunded liability that the city robbed from us years ago, just the interest alone at say a measly 4 % would be around 3 million a year, enough to give us all a raise to elevate our status throughout the county, a larger multiplier, true time and a half on our paychecks, total gross earnings pensionable, and a COLA of at least 3 percent starting at retirement age not age 60. And besides all that, there would still be plenty left over from the 3 million each year to let the pension grow huge. Look at the compounding effect of this type of growth and it is huge. Of course the city is reaping the benefit of the huge growth and compounding effect of our money. Thanks city management for robbing from our families for many years to come. Oh by the way, the COLA you offer is something, but it is a crum compared to the pile of riches you have taken from us already. Thanks again, our children (who really see us during holiday events) appreciate your generosity.
Received via Email 06-30-08 What ever happened to taking care of the retires ?????????????
TEAM: The city says, "Eat a bag of shit and die!"
Received via Email 07-01-08 If the city doesn't care about its current employees who risk their lives daily, do you really think they care about those that have given great service and has since retired? Probably not. Sad but true!
TEAM: We have already started on the road to change this. Politicians rule the roost. To be politically active is to ensure that we have a voice at the table. We now work under a 'strong mayor' form of gov't. As long as we have a shitbag MUTT for a mayor, we'll be his whipping boys. Paying dues to your Union isn't enough. Holding a political sign every four years for four hours isn't enough. An investment in time, sweat equity and money is a tried and proven path to victory. Several County Commission seats are up for grabs, this fall. Will you be available to work for those politicians that will work for you?
Received via Email 07-01-08 has anyone seen the new pay raise scale for the 2.5%? some of the salaries they projected on the sheet dont match if you do the math, any input?
TEAM: We did the math for Fire Fighter and it is correct.
Received via Email 07-01-08 Most of the complaints I have heard about this contract are basically about benefits we are getting and not benefits that are missing--- which is an interesting complaint. Nobody is against having a COLA, but they don't like "our" money being used to fund it. Isn't that what our 175 money is supposed to be used for? This is the first time I have seen it used exactly the way they are supposed to use it. People talk about it like the city is stealing union money, but that's not how it works. The money doesn't come to St. Petersburg with the union hall's address on it.
I've heard complaints about officers getting pay for keeping their paramedic patches--- so what? We get paid for having college degrees too. Higher education deserves higher pay--- go ask the teachers. Too many people getting a benefit is better than nobody. Why would you turn down money just because your co-worker is getting the same deal?
The insurance cutback is the biggest problem, but as I understand it is inevitable. Cities are getting out of the insurance business, just like they will be getting out of the pension business in a few years. I hate it, but it's coming like it or not.
My biggest complaint would be that the COLA should have been retroactive to at least everyone currently in the drop. Perhaps litigation could solve that, but don't look for the city council to address it. Back in the good old days the old pension guys only screwed over future employees, not those from the past. Things change. (Dick Tully, can you hear me?)
I also don't like capping the sick leave hours, but being able to call in sick and not go into your vacation time for the first 24 hours is a pretty good trade off. Hopefully, if I ever need more than 1950 hours off (if I ever see that many hours) there will be enough generosity on the job to kick some vacation time into my sick leave.
Not a perfect contract, but a few steps in the right direction. I am voting for it because I don't trust City Council to give us anything more... probably less or the exact same. We have friends there, but not enough and they answer to Big Bird-- not to us.
Good luck to everyone else with your decision. Vote for the entire contract and not just one or two issues.... there is a lot to consider.
TEAM: Thanks for your well reasoned response. While some may disagree with the ultimate outcome (either way), to beat on our Union officials for bringing an offer forward for us to accept or reject is absurd. Voting on a contract, minus any coersion, is the ultimate in democracy.
Received via Email 07-01-08 To the #3 7-01 poster, I would like to hear from the whiners that feel that a paramedic patch should not be worth a dime to those that dont ride as a paramedic and ask this. Why is there NO problem with 40hr employees all the way up to the ranks of division chiefs getting the $26 EMT patch pay? Do you think that they will ever again be exposed to the amount of medical calls during the remainder of their career as a Lt with a paramedic patch will see in an average shift on an Engine? Go ask you favorite HQ Division chief when was the last time he held C-spine or traction on a patient, or took a blood pressure for that matter. I am most certain that you will not be surprised at the answer. But the truth be told they get the money because the UNION bargains for EVERYBODY on the team. If you fall within the parameters you get the benefit, it just that simple. Secondly your reference to the old guys not screwing over their own....They did what they did to protect what they had. They chose to stop their gravy train for new comers, they did not have to protect any of those that were already here. Also the phrase that it is something we should have already had, AMEN to that. BUT we dont have it and now is our chance to get it. Follow the papers, any will do, you will see that pension enhancements are not a common thing right now. As was pointed out, vote for the entire contract and pick up you droopy lip and lets get on with our vote.
TEAM: Wanna bet money that Wimberly doesn't see a dime of the $75 biweekly Medic patch pay that's in this contract proposal?
Received via Email 07-01-08 I believe in patch pay. Call it an education incentive if that makes it feel better. I don't hold it against guys with degrees that they get paid more. And I don't care that a medic at #2 gets paid the same as a medic at the MFS. It's about the position and the experience, not the work load. Wanna be chief? Start studying.
Received via Email 07-02-08 read the contract not all medics are getting the $75 only Lts that do not ride and the gordon rule people. Not the current medics that are carrying the load. An LR will get an extra 450 a month for monitoring what a bargain.
Received via Email 07-02-08 FOR POSTERS #3 & #4 ON 7/1/2008 AND ANYONE ELSE WHO WANTS TO LEARN SOMETHING
Nope....can't hear a word you say. I thought the post was excellent. I'm only sorry that you still can't get the facts straight. Myself, and others who were currently on the job, have tried over and over to educate you about the history of the pensions. And I think you may possibly understand the facts. But you seem to feel the only way you can look "cool" to the uneducated ones on the job is to bash the educator. I can, though, admire the attempt to get a rise out of me and the bait is enticing. So for one last time I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and explain the truth to you. Please pass it on to the other "soon to be" pensionless folks employed on the fire department. Now pay close attention and try to grasp what I'm saying:
a. In 1971 the city of St. Petersburg decided that the current pension at the time for fire fighters was killing them financially due to the unfunded liability which had been pointed out by the union. Over the years the city had failed to contribute their portion of the funding to help make the "prior" pension actuarily sound. Let me put it another way. From the inception of the "prior" pension as a STATE LAW the city and the employees were required to put money into the funding of the pension. The employees did...the city did NOT. The city started out doing their funding but then began using the money for other things and created a gigantic unfunded liability for the future leaving only the fire service employees to contribute to the fund. We did so. Are you with me so far?
b. The city then came to Allen Wilson and told him that they were going to add an additional pension plan to the mix. It would be called the SUPPLEMENTAL PLAN. The Supplemental Plan would begin AS SOON AS THERE WERE NEW HIRES TO PUT ON IT. The city at that time OFFERED THE SUPPLEMENTAL PLAN TO THOSE ON THE JOB. Any current fire service employee who wanted could drop out of the "prior" plan and join the Supplemental Plan at that time. There were no takers. The city couldn't implement their Supplemental Plan without people being covered by it so the city came to the union and said that ALL NEW HIRES FROM THAT TIME ON WOULD BE ON THE SUPPLEMENTAL PLAN. Now here's the part I want you to get straight. The union had NO WAY TO STOP THE CITY FROM CREATING AND IMPLEMENTING AN ADDITIONAL PENSION PLAN. And at that time PENSIONS WERE NOT, I REPEAT NOT A COLLECTIVE BARGAINING ITEM. THERE WAS NO WAY FOR THE UNION TO NEGOTIATE THE SUPPLEMENTAL PENSION. Therefore we can hardly be blamed for not doing anything to "stop" it. The city was going to implement the new pension whether we liked it or not and there was NOTHING THE UNION COULD DO TO STOP IT. Is this coming through to you? If this is still a mystery to you, please read the paragraph again.
c. The first two members of the fire department to be hired under the new pension were Brown and Curry. They had the dubious honor of being the first two men hired after the implementation of the new pension. The city (to the best of my knowledge) never bothered to explain the "prior" pension to them since they needed the new hires to sign up for the Supplemental Pension to get it working. The union representatives met with the new hires and explained to them what the old pension was and what the new pension was and asked that they not come on the job under the Supplemental Pension. The union tried several times to talk the new hires out of coming on under those conditions but was unsuccessful. Two things were in the mill with these new hires. One, they were the first minorities to ever be hired into the fire service in the city. And two, they were the first to be covered by the Supplemental Pension. The city had a lot at stake. Are you keeping up? Now common sense tells you that neither Brown nor Curry were going to pass up being hired as fire fighters. So it was pretty much a given that the new pension would have it's first two members.
d. After that there were never any additional members to the "prior" pension plan. Those of us on it were locked in and ineligible for any other plans. (As an aside you may or may not remember that there were attempts by members of the "prior" plan to change over to the current plan and turned down.) The pension has since become a negotiable item at the table and there have been several changes made to it. As far as I know the changes have been made due to the demands of the union. Virtually all the members of the "prior" plan were aware that sooner or later we would all be retired. And that sooner or later we would all be dead and the city's largest unfunded liability and headache would go away. And we're slowly accomplishing that. The fact that you HAVE a pension and that you will soon have your COLA is something you should embrace and protect. Those coming behind you will no doubt HAVE NO PENSION. Won't it be interesting when they point at you and blame you for not protecting the pension for them.
Please tape this to your locker door and read it when you want to blame someone else for things that happen to you that they had no control over. And your buddy might want to read it too. Sorry big shooter but we didn't "do what we did to protect what we had". The state took care of that for us. We didn't "stop our gravy train". The city stopped it for us. And like you say brother, "Things change". And whether you like it or not, it's not always in your favor. No matter how hard you try you'll never be able to change what REALLY happened in 1971. You can crow all you want with your buddy but the facts will always be the same. You should worry more about what your union is doing today than what it did 37 years ago before you were born. It is the way it is and no amount of whining and bitching on your part or anyone else's is going to change it.
Fraternally,
Dick Tully ... legitimate questions answered cheerfully here......
TEAM: Thanks, Dick. Again you prove that ignorance can be fixed with education. If we don't write the words down, few of us will ever know them and it's getting harder and harder to recall the words we've all 'heard' in conversation.
Received via Email 07-02-08 ITS ALL GOOD PLEASE DON'T BITCH AND PLAY THE GAME I RIDE RESCUE 3 AND AND GET EXPOSED HES A D/C AND NEVERS GETS OUT OF THE CAR. WHO CARES..THE UNION GOT YOU BOTH MORE THAN YOU HAD BEFORE BE HAPPY .
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